1010 Engine problem

whiteclipse16 · Post by **whiteclipse16** » Sun Oct 11, 2015 4:24 pm

Having some problems with the 1010 diesel, here's the background. Roughly 2-3 years ago the motor was torn down and a new deck installed with all new gaskets. Once it was back together, we found the IP had went bad, so it was rebuilt, along with the injectors tested and cleaned up. Once that got straightened up we attempted to start it, but there was compression getting into the cooling system somehow. We thought it was head gasket, so we put another new one on and copper coated it, but it didn't solve the issue. We found the problem to be the copper washed within the turbulence chambers. After replacing them we attempted to start it again. This time it sounded much better, no compression in cooling system and it fired up and ran quite well. We let it run for roughly 10 min. until we located a leak in one of the reverser lines.
Today, we fixed the leaking line and got things back together. We hooked up the glow plugs and glowed it for 30sec. + and it immediately fired up. It ran for about 5 seconds and then died. Started cranking it again and it now sounds very odd. It looks like its puffing back through the intake. There doesn't seem to be nearly as much suction at the intake as was before today. It won't even fire now. Still seems to have good compression because I can barely roll it over by hand.
Anyone have any ideas? It almost seems like it suddenly 180 degrees out of time, but I don't know how that would have happened when it ran fine the other day. The other thought is that it bent some pushrods, but I don't know why it would've done that.
No ether was used today when it fired initially. Ether was used the other day, but sparingly since we didn't have the glows hooked up.

GaCatskinner · Post by **GaCatskinner** » Sun Oct 11, 2015 4:31 pm

Can you give a better time line? Your original post makes it sound like it was rebuilt and then sat for 2-3 years before you tried to get it running.

gregjo1948 · Post by **gregjo1948** » Mon Oct 12, 2015 3:46 am

If you don't have as much suction, you shouldn't have as much compression. Do you have fuel to your injectors? Does your fuel primer pump work? Are all your glow plugs heating? Not recommended to use starting fluid. gregjo1948

whiteclipse16 · Post by **whiteclipse16** » Mon Oct 12, 2015 6:02 am

Timeline is roughly this;
Rebuilt engine 2-3 years ago and attempted to start. Found bad IP.
Dozer sat for probably 6 months waiting on IP to be rebuild.
Got pump back and tried to start and noticed compression getting into cooling system. It sat roughly another 6 months, during that time it was slow progress at removing head and installing new head gasket, plus waiting for parts to come in.
Upon noticing the new head gasket didn't fix the problem, it sat probably 4 months before getting the new copper washers and getting them installed.
We couldn't get the fuel system sealed up at the pump so it sat 2-3 months while we got the parts and got that problem fixed.
I know my timeline doesn't correlate very well, but there's been so many issues that I've lost track. The dozer is at grandpa's farm, in the barn, where there is only a trouble light, and things aren't closed up, so working past dark or in cold weather is next to impossible, this causes things to take extra long.

Gregjo, I didn't crack injector lines yesterday but there was plenty of smoke coming out the exhaust as we cranked it. Fuel primer does work and we used it. I checked all glow plugs when we rebuild it and they heated good, so I assume they are working.

gregjo1948 · Post by **gregjo1948** » Mon Oct 12, 2015 6:44 am

Trying to use an old tired memory here.... Doesn't the inj/pump have a window that should shows timing? I'm thinking there are marks on the flywheel also. Seems like there is 180 degree mark too. I remember popping out # 1 injector, rolling engine over by hand,( make sure to rotate engine in the same direction as it runs) to find correct stroke for tdc. As it's coming to compression stroke, holding finger in injector hole, there should be pressure pushing on your finger. If you run past tdc, do not back it up....go thru strokes again. When you're getting close to tdc, check for timing marks. I'll have to find my shop manual to check accuracy of this info. gregjo1948

whiteclipse16 · Post by **whiteclipse16** » Mon Oct 12, 2015 8:31 am

It's been a while since I read through the timing sequence also, but that sounds correct.
I'll check that. I don't think it's a fuel issue though. The engine sounds totally different as it's cranking over now after the short 5 sec. runtime yesterday. Seems like something internal messed up but I don't understand how. Seems like too much puffback out the intake.

Any ideas on how to see the timing mark on the flywheel? It has the loader on it and the framework is right smack in front of that timing window.

gregjo1948 · Post by **gregjo1948** » Mon Oct 12, 2015 9:08 am

whiteclipse16 wrote:It's been a while since I read through the timing sequence also, but that sounds correct.
I'll check that. I don't think it's a fuel issue though. The engine sounds totally different as it's cranking over now after the short 5 sec. runtime yesterday. Seems like something internal messed up but I don't understand how. Seems like too much puffback out the intake.

Any ideas on how to see the timing mark on the flywheel? It has the loader on it and the framework is right smack in front of that timing window.

I don't think there should be any "puffback" unless there's a valve disorder. I'll be going to the shop and I'll check info in the shop manual, then post findings. gregjo1948

nails · Post by **nails** » Thu Oct 29, 2015 11:56 am

gregjo1948 wrote:Trying to use an old tired memory here.... Doesn't the inj/pump have a window that should shows timing? I'm thinking there are marks on the flywheel also. Seems like there is 180 degree mark too. I remember popping out # 1 injector, rolling engine over by hand,( make sure to rotate engine in the same direction as it runs) to find correct stroke for tdc. As it's coming to compression stroke, holding finger in injector hole, there should be pressure pushing on your finger. If you run past tdc, do not back it up....go thru strokes again. When you're getting close to tdc, check for timing marks. I'll have to find my shop manual to check accuracy of this info. gregjo1948

I just installed rebuilt IP on a 1010, and that's exactly how I timed it. It runs swell.
When I removed the window cover, fuel drained out of the IP. A 1/2" screw above the window appears to be for purging the fuel back in -- but maybe that's what the return-line is for. And I had to use gasket-seal when I put the window plate back on.
Long shot: Once the gear on a Toyota distributor broke loose from the bottom of distributor rotor, totally screwing up the timing. (I mean the long metal rotor, not the little plastic thing under the cap.) It was hard to find because the gear didn't spin on the rotor by hand -- I just sorta noticed that the roll pin wasn't right. Maybe your IP isn't hooked to the oil pump right? (I agree that it sounds more like valve timing than IP timing. But I'm no expert.)

whiteclipse16 · Post by **whiteclipse16** » Thu Oct 29, 2015 12:06 pm

Good point nails. I have thought along those lines that a woodruff key or something may have broken and now it's out of time. Haven't had the time or desire to dig into recently. The old girl fights us every time we try to resurrect her.

nails · Post by **nails** » Fri Oct 30, 2015 8:37 am

whiteclipse16 wrote:The old girl fights us every time we try to resurrect her.

Well, I'm sure it says "John Deere" all over it.

Tigerhaze · Post by **Tigerhaze** » Mon Nov 02, 2015 8:36 pm

This was a good thread about IP timing; although the discussion was specific to the 2010 the theory of operation is similar and may help:

http://www.jdcrawlers.com/messageboard/ ... =1010+fuel

You replacement of the head gasket got me to thinking it may be rocker arms out of adjustment because of a thicker new gasket- read this thread (at bottom by Jdemaris):

http://www.jdcrawlers.com/messageboard/ ... ght=timing

I'm just helping to brainstorm here- not saying I know your issue.

whiteclipse16 · Post by **whiteclipse16** » Fri Nov 06, 2015 10:07 pm

I had a chance to check a few things out tonight. You guys can look at the pictures and video linked below.
We've come to the conclusion that nothing is broken in the cam or crank and it is still correctly in time. We are fairly confident that the issue is, it sucked a significant amount of dirt into the intake and now the valves aren't sealing properly.
Let me know your thoughts.
The pictures are all at TDC.

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http://vid234.photobucket.com/albums/ee ... hfbtno.mp4

gregjo1948 · Post by **gregjo1948** » Sat Nov 07, 2015 4:25 am

How did the dirt get into the valves?

Post by **Lavoy** » Sat Nov 07, 2015 10:08 am

If you got enough dirt in the engine to damage valves, the bottom end is gone. Whatever damage dirt could do to valves, the rings and pistons have to be 10 times that amount. Are you sure it isn't just carbon?
Lavoy

nails · Post by **nails** » Sat Nov 07, 2015 10:29 am

What's the compression like?

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