440icd cold weather starting (part 2)

General help and support for your Lindeman through 2010 John Deere crawler
Post Reply
uler3161
40C crawler
40C crawler
Posts: 19
Joined: Tue Jan 03, 2017 12:26 pm
Location: Orofino, ID

440icd cold weather starting (part 2)

Post by uler3161 » Mon May 15, 2017 10:46 am

I posted awhile back about my 440icd being hard to start in cold weather, and then I found out one cylinder had really low compression. I bought a leak down tester and here's what I found.

Immediately after hooking up the leak down tester, I could hear air coming out of the exhaust. And the leak down gauge said 100% leak. This is with the rockers taken off, so valves should definitely have been closed. I tried rotating the valves to see if it would ever seal up better, but it won't.

So I assume I have something like a bent valve or a cracked head. Does that sound right? Would it be anything else?

At this point, I think my options are:
  1. Bring the head to a local diesel shop to be rebuilt
  2. Buy a rebuilt or new head off ebay
I think option 1 is cheaper, though I suppose that might depend up on what all is messed up. I suppose a cracked head can be fixed, but if it's cheaper to buy one off ebay, is there anything I need to look for? For instance, do I need a specific casting #?

User avatar
Lavoy
Site Admin
Site Admin
Posts: 10936
Joined: Sun Apr 03, 2005 8:32 pm
Location: North Dakota
Contact:

Re: 440icd cold weather starting (part 2)

Post by Lavoy » Tue May 16, 2017 9:51 am

Did you make sure the pistons were up far enough to cover the ports in the sleeves prior to testing?
Lavoy
Parts and restoration for antique and late model John Deere crawlers.
Owner and moderator www.jdcrawlers.com

uler3161
40C crawler
40C crawler
Posts: 19
Joined: Tue Jan 03, 2017 12:26 pm
Location: Orofino, ID

Re: 440icd cold weather starting (part 2)

Post by uler3161 » Tue May 16, 2017 1:30 pm

Lavoy wrote:
Tue May 16, 2017 9:51 am
Did you make sure the pistons were up far enough to cover the ports in the sleeves prior to testing?
Lavoy
I did attempt to roll it over with the starter as close as I could get to having the piston up. It was fairly close, but probably not all the way up. Would that matter in the case of testing for an exhaust leak?

User avatar
Lavoy
Site Admin
Site Admin
Posts: 10936
Joined: Sun Apr 03, 2005 8:32 pm
Location: North Dakota
Contact:

Re: 440icd cold weather starting (part 2)

Post by Lavoy » Wed May 17, 2017 9:32 am

If you had the intake ports partially exposed, the air leak out, or at least enough to not give you an accurate reading. If it is the exhaust valves, that much leakage would be easy to hear coming out the manifold.
Lavoy
Parts and restoration for antique and late model John Deere crawlers.
Owner and moderator www.jdcrawlers.com

uler3161
40C crawler
40C crawler
Posts: 19
Joined: Tue Jan 03, 2017 12:26 pm
Location: Orofino, ID

Re: 440icd cold weather starting (part 2)

Post by uler3161 » Wed May 17, 2017 9:43 am

Lavoy wrote:
Wed May 17, 2017 9:32 am
If you had the intake ports partially exposed, the air leak out, or at least enough to not give you an accurate reading. If it is the exhaust valves, that much leakage would be easy to hear coming out the manifold.
Lavoy
It definitely had leakage out the exhaust. Not only could I hear it, but could feel the air coming out the manifold.

User avatar
Lavoy
Site Admin
Site Admin
Posts: 10936
Joined: Sun Apr 03, 2005 8:32 pm
Location: North Dakota
Contact:

Re: 440icd cold weather starting (part 2)

Post by Lavoy » Wed May 17, 2017 10:00 am

Then I am afraid you have a broken or burned valve, that sucks.
Lavoy
Parts and restoration for antique and late model John Deere crawlers.
Owner and moderator www.jdcrawlers.com

uler3161
40C crawler
40C crawler
Posts: 19
Joined: Tue Jan 03, 2017 12:26 pm
Location: Orofino, ID

Re: 440icd cold weather starting (part 2)

Post by uler3161 » Sun Jul 16, 2017 4:30 pm

Well, good news. Took the head down to the local diesel shop and it's fixed. Valve seats were really pitted. They rebuilt the head and it starts almost immediately.

Now for the bad news. It doesn't seem to have the power it had, which I think I've gotten figured out to be governor adjustment, so I'm trying to go through the repair manual (Jensales) to adjust everything. I'm almost there, but not quite...

No matter what I do in terms of adjusting the low or high idle screws, or vertical link length, I can't seem to get the rpm range they have in the book. I'm either at the correct low rpm and around 1850 rpm, or I'm at the correct high rpm, but in the 700s somewhere on low. Is there another adjustment?

Which brings me to another adjustment that I don't understand and that is the buffer screw. What is that for? It doesn't seem to do anything. The manual suggests backing it off, then set low idle. After that, turn in the screw until it stops surging. I don't notice any surging anywhere I have the screw set. No matter where the screw is, the rpm seems to vary by about 20-30 rpms as I watch it, but I'm not sure I'd call that surging.

I think one of the problems I have with the low power is the shaft that the fuel rod rocker arm pivots on. I'm guessing what I have was replaced at some point. It looks like a bolt with a couple nylon washers on either side of the rocker arm. And then it has a nylon lock nut holding it on. I'm guessing I had that too tight and it didn't want to pivot free enough for the governor to respond to power loss. But I wonder if that should be some other kind of shaft that won't allow it to be over tightened?

I'm also going to try to get the shutoff cable fixed. The previous owner changed the throttle lever to handle shutoff. The actual shutoff mechanism looks a little sketchy. Almost like there should be a washer on the shaft that it pivots on to move it closer to the fuel rod rocker arm. I didn't see a diagram or a photo of this in my manual, so I really don't know. Does anyone have a good photo of this? I don't remember seeing one on the message board.

Thanks,
Dan

User avatar
Lavoy
Site Admin
Site Admin
Posts: 10936
Joined: Sun Apr 03, 2005 8:32 pm
Location: North Dakota
Contact:

Re: 440icd cold weather starting (part 2)

Post by Lavoy » Mon Jul 17, 2017 8:26 am

Fuel is not normally governor adjustment, that is rack adjustment. Governor is mostly RPM issue although obviously related. Sounds to me like it is not fully opening the injectors.
Lavoy
Parts and restoration for antique and late model John Deere crawlers.
Owner and moderator www.jdcrawlers.com

uler3161
40C crawler
40C crawler
Posts: 19
Joined: Tue Jan 03, 2017 12:26 pm
Location: Orofino, ID

Re: 440icd cold weather starting (part 2)

Post by uler3161 » Thu Jul 20, 2017 1:50 pm

After going all through the adjustments in my manual, it runs like a top. I think the big thing was the bolt that the fuel rod rocker arm pivots on. It was just too tight, causing the governor to not respond fast enough.

whiteclipse16
2010 crawler
2010 crawler
Posts: 622
Joined: Tue Mar 30, 2010 8:02 am
Location: Steubenville, OH

Re: 440icd cold weather starting (part 2)

Post by whiteclipse16 » Mon Jul 31, 2017 6:11 am

The buffer screw has a spring that it pushes against inside the governor. If I remember correctly mine was broken. You might pull that screw out and check yours, but if it's running good I'd leave well enough alone.
Ben

Great Grandpa's 1960 440ICD 602 blade
Between SN's: 455,633 - 456,801
Currently Rebuilding/Restoring

Post Reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 46 guests