1959 440 ICD - How to get it running?

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vadey23
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1959 440 ICD - How to get it running?

Post by vadey23 » Mon Jun 03, 2019 11:28 am

I recently inherited my dad's '59 JD 440 ICD crawler and I'd like to see about getting it running. I live about five hours from it, so I can't give any specifics on it's condition other than the fact that it's been sitting outside for the past few years as he didn't have suitable building space to house it. He kept an old coffee can over the exhaust which is good and the original shielding is all intact, so the engine should be fairly well protected. I personally know it ran probably about three years ago, but am unsure if he had it running since.

I'm just looking for any advice on what to address first on it. I know I'll probably need to add oil (what kind of oil specifically?), coolant, and obviously fuel. It will probably need new battery cables as well as a new battery (what kind of battery do these machines need?). From what I've read, these Detroit 2-53 diesel's are some pretty resilient engines, so I'm confident with a little TLC it should fire up. Not sure about the rest of the machine like the hydraulics or drive-train, but we'll cross that bridge when we get there. From what I remember, the hydraulic lines were in pretty good shape, but I could be mistaken. I won't be in front of it again until the end of the month, so that's when I'm aiming to get it going. I don't remember it having a keyed ignition switch as I think my dad bypassed that and pulled it out, but again, not 100% certain on that.

Any help is much appreciated.

Dave

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Re: 1959 440 ICD - How to get it running?

Post by dtoots1 » Mon Jun 03, 2019 12:24 pm

first thing you need to do..is add your location to your profile..someone may be close by to help.
will probably need to drain and clean the fuel tank unless the tank is near full there will be loose rust and other stuff in it. will need to find out what size battery whether 6volt or 12 volt. if 6 volt it will be positive ground, usually if changed to 12 volt will have alternator and would be negative ground. general cleanup is a help in locating wires, leaks , nests etc. get the book out and check all the oils....loosen the oil pan drain and catch a cup to see if water in engine oil, if so will probably need changed, can probably just use straight 30wt. as will need to change it again after seeing if can start. check radiator fluid for any oil and leaks if not full. not sure if has glow plugs, if it does i believe you have to turn the key to the left to heat them, tho you think he may have disconnected the key switch, so don't know.
others will be chiming in with more knowledge..

welcome aboard

vadey23
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Re: 1959 440 ICD - How to get it running?

Post by vadey23 » Mon Jun 03, 2019 12:55 pm

For clarification, I'm in Olathe, KS and the dozer is in rural Waterloo, IA.

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Lavoy
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Re: 1959 440 ICD - How to get it running?

Post by Lavoy » Mon Jun 03, 2019 2:23 pm

Diesel will be 12 volts, positive ground, group 24 battery 650CCA or bigger will work fine. Engine oil is Chevron Delo 100 or equivalent ONLY. DO NOT just add any 15W-40 oil. Two strokes Detroit diesels require the use of a specific type of oil, DELO 100 meets that specification. You will likely need to go to a local oil jobber to get it, not many places stock it. It holds 8 or 9 quarts I think, I would just get a 5 gallon pail if you can not find gallon jugs.
If it has been outside, I would just drain every oil in it, it is going to have water or moisture in it if it has been sitting outside. Get the old oils out, get it started and moving to warm it up and get the new oils and gear lubes moving around. If after doing all this, any of the oils are milky, I would drain and flush or refill again. Oils absorb acids which in turn eat away at critical components, introduction of water seems to exacerbate this. I have had multiple crawlers that have sat outside and got water in the fluids. It will literally eat chunks our of gears and such.
If you have not already, get factory parts and service manuals for it, you will need them, can't do anything without them. Might also get an owners manual if you are new to crawlers. I can get them for you if need be, might have owners on hand, but not parts and service.
Reverser is Deere HyGard or equivalent, finals and trans are 80W-90 gear lube, Dino or synthetic is your choice. I would use Dino first go around til I knew I had all moisture out.
Hyd is AW32 or AW46 plain hyd oil. HyGard will work, but will howl and you will forfeit some pressure.
Steering clutches are likely stuck, but once it is running, you will know more on that score.
Congrats on inheriting a family piece of equipment, that is always special.
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vadey23
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Re: 1959 440 ICD - How to get it running?

Post by vadey23 » Mon Jun 03, 2019 2:59 pm

Thanks so much for this info, it's very much appreciated. I'm fairly handy and mechanically inclined, but I haven't spent much time around equipment from the late 50's/early 60's. I have found a parts list through John Deere that I can use as a guide. Unfortunately, all of the manuals are gone so those would need to be bought second-hand now. I see that ebay appears to have what would be needed. Is it encouraged to use ether or starting fluid after it's been sitting so long? The battery he had on it wasn't your typical sized 12 volt battery that you'd find in a car or truck, but a much longer version of that. I've not had to buy one like that before, so I wanted to make sure to ask before I purchased anything.

Thanks again,

Dave

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Re: 1959 440 ICD - How to get it running?

Post by Jim B » Mon Jun 03, 2019 3:22 pm

Lavoy can likely set you up with the right manuals.

Around here we can buy group 31 batteries cheaper than most 12 volt car batteries. Most of the trucks use those now so the volume has apparently brought the price down some, you might want to check those as well. Your description of the battery in it sounds like it might be a 4D. A 4D would be 20-3/4" long, 8-3/4" wide and 9-7/8" high. As Lavoy said it doesn't need to be that big if it is a group 4D.

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Re: 1959 440 ICD - How to get it running?

Post by gregjo1948 » Tue Jun 04, 2019 4:24 am

I don't believe the 2-53 Detroit use glow plugs so I think starting fluid would be alright to use. Don't load it up with the fluid first. Start cranking the engine over , then apply a mist over the intake. I like to bypass the air cleaner so the fluid doesn't have to go thru the oil bath filter. I feel it's apt to build up in the oil then, when the engine fires, it sucks too much starting fluid into the engine and cause serious damage. Almost seems like I remember a small pipe plug in the intake manifold which could be removed and the fluid could be shot thru the hole. I don't remember how to shut down the engine so, before trying to fire it up, see if there's a fuel shut down lever/knob/rod. It might shut down by simply closing the throttle. You certainly need to be sure it's going to get fuel to start up. Also be sure the fuel is turned on from the tank. Good luck, that's a nice engine.
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Re: 1959 440 ICD - How to get it running?

Post by Lavoy » Tue Jun 04, 2019 8:28 am

Unless it has been rebuilt with N series pistons, you will probably find that the only way it will start below 80 degrees is with ether. I just found the Deere service bulletin on starting 440 and 435 that shows the use of ether. The critical thing is not to overdo it, a little whiff while spinning should be all it takes.
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Re: 1959 440 ICD - How to get it running?

Post by JWB Contracting » Wed Jun 05, 2019 7:26 am

Consider the following when starting a Detroit that’s been sitting a while:

- drain the engine oil and prelube the engine engine with high pressure oil, we tap into an oil pressure port and pump in fresh oil with a 12V electric over hydraulic unit.

- pull the valve cover and check for stuck injectors and operation of the fuel rack. We start them without the valve cover in place with wise grips on the fuel rack. If an injector is stuck the engine will run away on you. We unstick the injectors by applying fluid film and working the fuel rod and plunger back and forth. There are not many that we haven’t been able to unstick.

- I don’t think 253’s came with a blower trip / shut off so if it runs away on you only way to stop it is to plug the intake

I enjoy the Detroit’s, my dad dealt in the until the end of small logging operators in the late 90’s in our area, still sell a few a year. They are getting hard to find.

My dozer always needs either, however the 435 starts excellent without it.
Jason Benesch

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Re: 1959 440 ICD - How to get it running?

Post by frozendozer » Wed Jun 05, 2019 10:31 am

when I got mine, if too had sat for a long time. Water had got into the blower and froze up cracking a rotor vane. Once repaired I put the jumper cables on it, checked to make sure it had oil, and fuel, a couple of squirts of either and it flashed up buetifully.

After that, it was true love and like anyone in love I started going thru the old girl and even gave it a name "snarley" after my wife

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Re: 1959 440 ICD - How to get it running?

Post by Stan Disbrow » Thu Jun 06, 2019 5:56 am

Hi,

I always have a 1/8" aluminum plate handy to stick over the air intake of any diesel that hasn't run in a while, or just overhauled. Plate is large enough to cover and keep my hands away. Had to use it a couple times, too. Of course one needs to have the intake open and flat so the plate will suck up to it if needed.

Stan
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vadey23
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Re: 1959 440 ICD - How to get it running?

Post by vadey23 » Mon Jun 24, 2019 8:10 am

UPDATE
So, I went to my dad's this weekend to see about getting the dozer started and after a few hours we got it running and it sounded great. I did have to get a group 4D battery (aka the big, long industrial battery). I initially bought a 730 CCA 12v battery and it didn't have the power to turn the engine over. Once I got the bigger battery on it, it started up after some sprays of starting fluid. We also had to play around with the throttle as it seemed to be sticking, and there was a bit of a lack of fuel at first, but we got that figured out.

Once we got it running on it's own, I discovered a hydraulic hose leak when I tried to move the blade. It was spewing pretty bad so I shut it down and considered the day to be a partial success; at least I got it started and running. I'll have to go up another weekend now to get the hydro hoses replaced, but shouldn't be a terrible fix. Once that's done, it should hopefully be good to go.

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Re: 1959 440 ICD - How to get it running?

Post by Lavoy » Mon Jun 24, 2019 9:46 am

If it won't spin on a 730 amp battery, you have a problem, that is more battery than they had in that size in 1959. Might be bad cables, or bad starter.
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gregjo1948
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Re: 1959 440 ICD - How to get it running?

Post by gregjo1948 » Tue Jun 25, 2019 3:52 am

I just got an Allis Chalmers D17 wheel tractor and it wouldn't crank over with a fully charged 12 volt battery. Solenoid was working as it should getting power to the starter but it just acted as if the engine was seized. It had been starting without a problem until this episode. Pulled the starter off only to find it was so packed with mouse house, it couldn't turn. There was a weep hole big enough to stick a finger in. I don't know how those little critters can get into a machine with a hole on the bottom and at least 2' off the ground. Perhaps that Detroit, we're discussing, has a nest mess.
JD 350B diesel 6way blade, Case 580B Loader/backhoe, Farmall 504 high crop w/ flail boom mower, International 404 , International 284 diesel w/belly mower, 1972 Ford F600 dump truck, Galion 3-5 roller, Allis Chalmers D17, 1620 Ford

vadey23
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Re: 1959 440 ICD - How to get it running?

Post by vadey23 » Tue Jun 25, 2019 7:51 am

As I mentioned before, the previous battery I pulled off was a group 4D battery as well, so I merely swapped it with a new version of what had been on there. At the end of the day, it started and sounded great once it shook the cobwebs out. I believe it might have a replacement starter on it as it's not the industrial yellow color like everything else under the hood. So, that could explain the need for a bigger battery, I don't know. Also to note, I replaced the battery cables that were on the machine previously as well. They were 2 gauge cables. The neighbor was there with me and he knows a lot about old diesels and he was the first to advise on the need for the bigger battery, so I feel confident in what we did.

Thanks again for the advice and commentary.

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