420c carb & roller grease questions

[Fallon]

I just picked up a 1956 420c loader. Mostly as a toy, partially as a backup to my newish Kubota if it ever gets stuck or for loading impliments on the trailer when the tractor is away. It was in great shape except for the hydraulic cylinders needing a rebuild.

It ran great for an hour, then promptly died. A bunch of gas came out of the carb, so presumably a stuck float or something. I pulled the carb & tore the gasket pulling it apart to check the float. I went to get a rebuild kit & ran into some confusion.

The carb on my machine is a TSX 41 156 as per the tag. https://www.steinertractor.com/JDS3638- ... Repair-Kit & other sites indicate a 420 should have a Marvel ScheblerTSX641 or TSX678 & that a TSX156 is off an International Harvester.

Should I get a TSX156 rebuild kit or the TSX641/687 kit? I presume the carbs are pretty similar. Did the one on my machine get swapped out as some point in the past 65 years with a similar but different one?

Also there are grease zerks on the rollers instead of the button connectors I saw mentioned in other threads. Do I need to get cornhead grease & a low pressure gun as noted in the other threads?


https://photos.app.goo.gl/TC5Rk7QMTpPxNNHo9


https://photos.app.goo.gl/iVCu3oWtzzWXKiQEA

[Jim B]

Can you post a picture of the tag?

What is the length of the bowl gasket? 4-1/4", 5", or 5-3/16".

It appears the TSX 641 has 2-11/16" mounting stud centers and the TSX 156 has 2-5/16 stud centers. It doesn't appear the two use the same kit so it would be best to try to confirm which it actually has on it.

I expect someone didn't have a button fitting gun end and changed the button heads to regular zerks. Yes, you need corn head grease and a low pressure gun.

[Fallon]

Link to my google photos album of my 420c... https://photos.app.goo.gl/MVXdfagbvRuiUiv96

In particular https://photos.app.goo.gl/XnXM7ZMA1cmwmLxv9 for the carb tag.

Will fight with embedding the photos properly, but Google Photos always wants to link rather than let you embed.

[Fallon]

Hopefully this works, shows up in a preview for me at least & the images should be publicly viewable.

[Jim B]

As I suspected, it is a TSX 641. The 6 is visible in your picture. The 1 56 is a reference to the carburetor's build date. Pictures taken at different angles often help with reading "faded" numbers. The 6 appears to have been lightly stamped compared to the others. A bit of light rubbing with some Scotch Brite and brake cleaner will bring it out more.

Lavoy Wilcox, owner and provider of this website, repairs these crawlers and sells parts for them. You can be sure that if he uses them in his shop, they are good quality, and he is a knowledgeable resource if you have problems, not just a parts peddler. For parts he has posted he prefers a direct contact, not a question/request on the Boards. You can email him (postmaster@jdcrawlers.com) or call him at 701-361-1006 during CST business hours.

[Fallon]

Thanks for getting me on track. I couldn't see that 6 at all. It showed up way more in the photo than in real life & I wasn't looking at the picture much. Have the carb completely disassembled. Some quality time with my solvent tank, heated simple green in a ultrasonic cleaner & carb cleaner finally got it looking pretty decent. The 6 shows up a fair bit better. That grime on the carb & the back of the machine is amazing, somewhere between JB weld & chewing gum. Amazing what 65 years of oil, grease & dirt turns into.

Will sort out getting a standard carb kit on Monday. Should be pretty straight forward at this point & I've watched a pile of Youtube videos on rebuilding the TSXes.

Speaking of illegible tags, any idea what the loader is on the crawler? That tag is even worse. Much more of an academic issue as pins or hoses are dead standard parts so I'm not likely to need to hunt anything down on model number. I'm assuming my local hydraulic shop can figure out what seals for the cylinders when I take them in.

[Canuck 420c]

Welcome to the forum.Mike's has Marvel Schebler parts aswell

https://www.carburetor-parts.com/marvel ... etor-parts

[Jim B]

TSX 641 should use a (Standard Motor Products) Hy Grade # 1305 basic carb kit. Any parts store that carries SMP parts should be able to get that kit or get one in the brand they carry using your carb number.

Do you have torch tip clears or small wires to clean passages with? It is best to run something through the passages not just blow carb cleaner and air through them. Use care not to oversize the passage or break the cleaner of in one. A web search for "Marvel Schebler TSX & DLTX Carburetor Service Manual" will find several free copies of the same manual that several places are selling. You can download and print a copy, if you don't have a one.

Your last group of pictures don't show, at least I can't open them. I upload pictures to Postimages and upload them to the site from there. Imgur is another third-party hosting site that works as well.

You might add your general location to your profile. Something might come up that your general location could get you a lead that wouldn't happen otherwise.

[Canuck 420c]

Looks like a Davis bucket on that crawler?

[Jim B]

A web search for WMD6 (stamped in the ID plate) is a Wagner loader model. The 40C would indicate it was specified for a 40C. Wagner had mountings and modifications to fit their models to various machines. Ford tractors were big users of Wagner loaders. The N Tractor Club library has a WMD6 manual, likely for a Ford.

[Fallon]

Got the carb put together last night. Put it on thismorning & it fired right up. Only had to remove it once to get the choke hooked up. I probably need to fiddle with the adjustments a bit, but it was running pretty good.

Moved it up to the shop & spent the day firing up the hot pressure washer & cleaning off all the vehicles. Blasted off decades of grime on the back & all the leaks on the loader. As I somewhat expected it's not firing up now. I'm assuming its spark, but was more interested in a shower after the pressure washer. Will tackle that tomorow or later this week. I was planning on pulling the plugs anyway, but it looks like I may get to learn about points now. First vehicle I've ever owned with em, every other one I've owned since the 90s has been electronic ignition.

Low pressure gun & a box of cornhead grease showed up today as well. So will probably grease the rollers tomorow. Not bothering greasing the loader as I'll be pulling those cylinders after I get it running again. Looks like JB weld on one of the fittings hiding under the grease, so that may be fun.

At least I kmore or less new what I was in for getting an antique dozer. I was expecting, or fearing more undercarrige & clutch issues than engine issues though, so I think this is good news.

[Fallon]

Oh, and thanks for pointing me in the right direction on the carb stuff & roller lube. Crossing the gap from not knowing what you dont know to knowing what you don't know is alway harder than the finally learning the details of what you dont know.

[Jim B]

The pressure washing likely got some moisture inside the distributor. Not uncommon for a running engine not to start after a bath. Check that and dry it out of it is we inside.

[Fallon]

The pressure washing likely got some moisture inside the distributor. Not uncommon for a running engine not to start after a bath. Check that and dry it out of it is we inside.

Ya, I was half expecting issues because of the washing. Given how much oil was on there from the leaking cylinders & caked layers of oil, grease & dirt caked into an plastic like substance I figured it was worth the risk.

Figure I'll basically be following https://youtu.be/Fhg8_mHqN2g?si=_Twy1Vg9rh0EpiSp

[Fallon]

Tune-up kit arrived a little while ago. Took the day off yesterday as it was 65 degrees & did some chores, including steam cleaning it again after I pulled the hood off. Snowing today, so who knows when I'll find the motivation & finger dexterity to put the new wires, plugs & distributor parts on. It cranked over fine, so no water in the exhaust or anything after the cleanings. Just need to fiddle with the spark.