440IC gas engine runs for 30 seconds to 1 minute then dies

[charless]

My engine starts easily and runs fine for very short time and then abruptly dies. When I try to start it, it fires but dies. Doesn't seem like a carburation problem as it dies very abruptly. Gas flows freely out of the fuel filter when I disconnect the fuel line. Just had shop put in new points. Could it be a coil, alternator, regulator or something else in the electrical system that heats up quickly or vibrates loose? If I let it sit for a while, then it will start and again run fine for only a very short time. How can I tell if my coil and/or alternator are bad?

[cuznguido]

First make sure you have fuel in the carburetor when it quits. You might have fuel at the filter but not at the carb. Assuming that it is not a fuel problem, the next time it quits, QUICKLY check and see if you have spark. It sounds like it might be either the coil or the resistor on the coil (if it has an external resistor). You need to check it quickly before it has time to cool. If you do not have spark, check for voltage on the input (+) side of the coil. If you do, then check the output side (-). If that is not the problem, then the next time it quits, again do it quickly, pop the distributor cap and with the ignition on, break the points and see what color the spark is. Should be nice and blue, if it is not then the condensor may be the problem. If you suspect that, let it cool and do it again and see if the spark is now blue. If so, then the condensor is failing when it gets hot.

[Gil]

Guido's comments are right on. I might suggest you buy an inline spark plug tester. They plug in between the spark plug and the distributor wire and you can visually see if you have or loose spark. They are cheap and work on 12 or 6 volt systems. You can probably stand beside the crawler and manually start it by pulling the starter rod at the starter (having the ignition switch on) so you can watch the tester. Throw a tarp over your shoulders or do it at night if you cannot see the spark light.

Although the best place to start looking is where the last repair was done, at the points and condensor, but I would not dismiss a fuel problem. A loss of gas or air can cut off the engine quickly. The generator and regulator charging circuits can just be bypassed to eliminate any concern you have about them.

[CELSESSER]

Charles,
To follow up on the last comment, have you checked the air cleaner? Also to follow up on the fuel side, have you checked the little wire screen filter inside the carb inlet. Sounds more like fuel starved to me.

Chuck

[joeturner1977]

Maybe you want to check the fuel tank for larger debris. I have already seen those little ladybug beetles in the tanks of farm tractors. They are small enough to get in the fuel line before the sediment bowl and to large to fit into the sediment bowl. If you take flash light sometimes you can see them (or something simmilar, ie: chainsaw sawdust, bees)laying on the bottom of the tank. I think this comes from leaving empty gas cans with the pour spout open while in the garage.

[jeff Kemp]

I just had a similar problem with my 440. It was the coil! Darn thing gave me every indication it was a fuel problem but I found that the coil started shorting out once it got hot.

[Randynscottsboro]

I had the same problem with my 420 rubber tire and it was a brass screen filter in the fitting going into the carb. Plenty of fuel at the carb, but very little going into the float bowl.
Randy

[charless]

Thanks so much everyone for your advice and suggestions. It finally turned out that the screw that adjusts the point opening/closing was loose and in moving a tiny bit back/forth would cause the engine to die. Don't quite know why it would start again for a bit, but oh well...good to have that fixed. Ran my little dozer for a few hours doing some landscaping and then broke a track....now need to research how to drive a pin, or whatever you call it, out and put a new one in again. I'm us against a hillside on the broken track side (wouldn't you just know it!) so I need to figure out a way to get the track back together temporarily to move it where I can work on it. Am thinking I could get a come-along to pull the track ends together and then loop a strong chain through the holes in the track, fasten the chain together with something and then try to tow or drive the dozer back away from the bank. Any suggestions on any of this would be greatly appreciated....I'm in the process of going back over past postings where I remember having seen information on the subjects. THX again to all for your kind assistance. Charles

[Gil]

Well I'm feeling kind of confident since my earlier suggestion about your initial problem: "the best place to start looking is where the last repair was done, at the points and condenser"; so maybe I'll take a shot at you second problem.

Why bother with the tracks at all now? I course I do not know how muddy it is, or how accessible the location, or what other equipment you have, etc. But if your track is broken apart, why not just pull the crawler out and let the track stay where it is? The JD440 is not that heavy and another decent size piece of equipment could pull it out. It might help to put a sheet of plywood, boards, or roofing tin under the rollers to keep them out of the ground.

Just move it far enough so you can get around it to work and so you will have a firm place to jack up the side. Then you can look at the track, see what is wrong with it (I'm not sure what you mean by a "broken track"), fix it, and drag it back in place.

Note: the best place to position the end of the track to put the master pin back in, is the lower rear of the sprocket. That would be 7 or 8 o'clock if you were working on the right hand side. Don't put the tack on backwards. Good Luck.

[charless]

Thanks for your response....I have two broken track links actually. Interestingly enough, one of the undersides of both links had been broken for who knows how long (they were rusty and worn where the breaks were), so I had perhaps been using the dozer for a considerable time before the opposite sides of the links broke on the inside.

The track is still aligned straight under the lower rollers so I would like to pull it together and move the dozer back to a good working area with the track still on because I don't have equipment to move it once it is off the dozer.

I certainly appreciate your thoughts and suggestions. You were indeed right on when you suggested I go back to the latest repair.

THX MUCH
Charles

[Gil]

My only other suggestion would be to concentrate on a solution that will work where the track goes around the sprocket, when you design any kind of temporary attachment. Any hardware you add must be flexible enough and meet the clearances required to negotiate the sprocket.

Baling twine and duct tape are usually my standard solutions – but I don’t think they will be strong enough here.

[charless]

I am thinking of looping a strong chain through the mud holes on the track after I pull the ends together with a come along....what do you think?

[KenP]

deleted

[charless]

Have never worked on a 440, so this may not be of any help. But, I did the exact same thing as you (broke a chain link) earlier this year on my 350.

A previous owner had broken the link and attempted to weld the two pieces back together. It held for a short time and then it snapped. Of course I didn't see any of this until is broke.

Talked to the local Crawler place and was given two options. First, I was told that I could replace just the link by burning out the pins with a torch and then using two Master pins to put the "new" link in place. The guy told me that the regular pins could not be driven out by hand and would require a track press to push them out... so they had to be cut out.
Second choice was to buy replacement chain/track. This is what I finally did so I have no experience with the first option.

Your idea of using a chain between the pieces may get you out of the field to where you can work on it IF you have room where the track goes over the idler, rollers, and sprocket. This certainly would not have worked on my 350. If you don't have room, maybe a couple of short chain pieces with their ends welded to the adjacent shoes to hold them together. You can cut them off when your're done. Leave a little slack because the shoes move apart from each other when going over the idler and sprocket. Just a thought.

Thanks Ken....good advice re welding the chain across the break.