Havin some problems with my electrical system. I know this should be simple and it probably is a simple fix. I bough this 440 gas with none of the gauges working including the ignition switch. It was ...shall we say hot wired. I have since replaced all the gauges. The temp and oil are now mechanical. It has been changed over from 6 to 12 volt negative ground with an Alterntor with an internal regulator. I"m pretty sure my problem is in that ignition switch to what gets routed where. I have the wiring diagram but its for a 6 volt with external regulator positive ground.. ... Chime in please with help. My dime if you want a phone chat
Electrical challenged
Jeff
Electrical
Electrical
440 IC #448161 W/Henry loader, 3020 D, #8 mower
digger sr,
Go to www.ytmag.com and search for "Recommendations for 12 volt conversions" by Genesee Products.
That is what I used when I Gutted and rewired mine. The only problem I had was that I initially had the hot lead to the ignition switch on the wrong side of the ammeter(which doesn't work). Once I switched that everything worked (except the ammeter)
Chuck
Go to www.ytmag.com and search for "Recommendations for 12 volt conversions" by Genesee Products.
That is what I used when I Gutted and rewired mine. The only problem I had was that I initially had the hot lead to the ignition switch on the wrong side of the ammeter(which doesn't work). Once I switched that everything worked (except the ammeter)
Chuck
1960 440ICD #461094 w/ #63 manual blade Converted to a gas engine two owners ago.
I'd recommend a voltmeter over an ammeter as it's: 1. cheaper 2.simpler to wire 3. not gonna be a shut down item if it fails 4. able to give as pertinent an indication as an ammeter. I'd also recommend a fusible link wire (or a maxi-fuse) in line with the feeds to the ignition & light switches. A crawler is an excellent candidate for a first wirng job as it is virtually stone axe simple (especially with the 12v & internal regulator alternator conversions). WAY Good Luck!
-
Stan Disbrow
- 350 crawler
- Posts: 2904
- Joined: Fri Jul 15, 2005 3:13 pm
- Location: Raleigh, NC
Hi,
I'm presuming you're using the original switch on the 440, which I refer to as an 'ILBD' switch.
It has a common lug which connects to the battery via a fuse.
The 'I' position lug connects to the ignition.
It also connects to the cut-out terminal of the alternator if you have one, presuming you're using an alternator with an integrated regulator.
Some integrated regulator alternators don't have a cut-out terminal and some do. Some automatically cut-out when the rotor stops turning. Others use a second, small, lead for the cut-out function. This would attach to the ignition lug on the switch, so the alternator regulator would be cut-off when the ignition was cut-off.
The 'L' position lug connects to the front lights.
The 'B' position lug connects to the rear light.
The 'D' position lug would connect to the rear light thru a resistor or to a separate small lamp inside the rear light housing that shines thru a ruby-red circle formed on the back side of the sealed beam - if I'm not the only person left in the world that still has one of these that works, that is!
The 'D' position is meant to provide a red rear light when running down the road. This use was always rather doubtful when it comes to crawlers, although it made sense on the wheel tractors. If you don't care about this, then leave it disconnected.
If you're still using a 6v coil, then you need to have a resistor in series with the coil. If you put on a 12v coil, then don't use a resistor, obviously.
You connect the output terminal of the alternator to the battery directly, not thru the ignition switch. Alternators have diodes in the output that prevent any back flow of power via the output lead.
Some integrated regulator alternators don't have a cut-out terminal and some do. Meaning, some automatically cut-out when the rotor stops turning and others use a second, small, lead for the cut-out function. This would attach to the ignition lug on the switch, so the alternator's regulator would be cut-off when the ignition was cut-off.
You can run the alternator output thru the ammeter, so it shows you the rate of charge. If you attach the ignition switch input to the ammeter as well, using the same terminal the alternator is attached to, then it will show you the amps going into the battery less the load of the ignition, lights, and whatever else you might have connected.
That said, I agree with the use of a voltmeter over an ammeter. A voltmeter allows one to see the charge level of the battery prior to starting and that helps a lot when the battery gets old and starts becoming problematical.
A voltmeter would be connected to the ignition lug on the switch, so it comes live as soon as you turn the ignition on. You don't want the voltmeter to be live all the time, as they do drain a little bit of power when active, unlike an ammeter. If the machine were to sit long enough with the voltmeter active, then the battery would drain.
More on the lights. The earlier machines used lights that had separate lenses and reflectors and used small bulbs in sockets. The later ones used sealed beam lamps. My 58 series-III 420 has sealed beam lamps as original, so I'd expect a 440 to use them as well. I figured I'd mention this as some folks will not have sealed beam lamps on their machines and wonder what in heck I'm talking about there!
later!
Stan
I'm presuming you're using the original switch on the 440, which I refer to as an 'ILBD' switch.
It has a common lug which connects to the battery via a fuse.
The 'I' position lug connects to the ignition.
It also connects to the cut-out terminal of the alternator if you have one, presuming you're using an alternator with an integrated regulator.
Some integrated regulator alternators don't have a cut-out terminal and some do. Some automatically cut-out when the rotor stops turning. Others use a second, small, lead for the cut-out function. This would attach to the ignition lug on the switch, so the alternator regulator would be cut-off when the ignition was cut-off.
The 'L' position lug connects to the front lights.
The 'B' position lug connects to the rear light.
The 'D' position lug would connect to the rear light thru a resistor or to a separate small lamp inside the rear light housing that shines thru a ruby-red circle formed on the back side of the sealed beam - if I'm not the only person left in the world that still has one of these that works, that is!
The 'D' position is meant to provide a red rear light when running down the road. This use was always rather doubtful when it comes to crawlers, although it made sense on the wheel tractors. If you don't care about this, then leave it disconnected.
If you're still using a 6v coil, then you need to have a resistor in series with the coil. If you put on a 12v coil, then don't use a resistor, obviously.
You connect the output terminal of the alternator to the battery directly, not thru the ignition switch. Alternators have diodes in the output that prevent any back flow of power via the output lead.
Some integrated regulator alternators don't have a cut-out terminal and some do. Meaning, some automatically cut-out when the rotor stops turning and others use a second, small, lead for the cut-out function. This would attach to the ignition lug on the switch, so the alternator's regulator would be cut-off when the ignition was cut-off.
You can run the alternator output thru the ammeter, so it shows you the rate of charge. If you attach the ignition switch input to the ammeter as well, using the same terminal the alternator is attached to, then it will show you the amps going into the battery less the load of the ignition, lights, and whatever else you might have connected.
That said, I agree with the use of a voltmeter over an ammeter. A voltmeter allows one to see the charge level of the battery prior to starting and that helps a lot when the battery gets old and starts becoming problematical.
A voltmeter would be connected to the ignition lug on the switch, so it comes live as soon as you turn the ignition on. You don't want the voltmeter to be live all the time, as they do drain a little bit of power when active, unlike an ammeter. If the machine were to sit long enough with the voltmeter active, then the battery would drain.
More on the lights. The earlier machines used lights that had separate lenses and reflectors and used small bulbs in sockets. The later ones used sealed beam lamps. My 58 series-III 420 has sealed beam lamps as original, so I'd expect a 440 to use them as well. I figured I'd mention this as some folks will not have sealed beam lamps on their machines and wonder what in heck I'm talking about there!
later!
Stan
There's No Such Thing As A Cheap Crawler!
Useta Have: '58 JD 420c 5-roller w/62 inside blade
Useta Have: '78 JD350C w/6310 outside blade
Useta Have: '68 JD350, '51 Terratrac GT-25
Have: 1950 M, 2005 x495, 2008 5103 (now known as 5045D)
Useta Have: '58 JD 420c 5-roller w/62 inside blade
Useta Have: '78 JD350C w/6310 outside blade
Useta Have: '68 JD350, '51 Terratrac GT-25
Have: 1950 M, 2005 x495, 2008 5103 (now known as 5045D)
digger sr,
This is what my diagram ended up looking like
it shows my mistake of taking the hot to the fuse from the neg side of the ammeter, switched it to the pos side and let there be power...
P.S. that is the view of the back side of the panel in case anyone was cornfused.
Chuck[/img]
This is what my diagram ended up looking like
it shows my mistake of taking the hot to the fuse from the neg side of the ammeter, switched it to the pos side and let there be power...
P.S. that is the view of the back side of the panel in case anyone was cornfused.
Chuck[/img]
1960 440ICD #461094 w/ #63 manual blade Converted to a gas engine two owners ago.
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