New member, questions about 420c engine clutch

[Paulywally]

Hey everyone long time reader first time poster. Love the site and all of its helpful info and parts.

Quick history, got a 420c 5 roller, it's been in the family for a long time. Was my fathers, he passed about 12 years ago and the last time it was really used was 15 years ago. Shortly after my dad passed my uncle was using it. Said the clutch is gone. ( I was too young to know much). So I remember helping him put in a new clutch with the flywheel resurfaced.

After we finished I remember getting it all back together and it still wouldn't drive. So here I am 10 years later back with my own knowledge to figure it out.

I got it going. (carb rebuild, water pump, ignition parts etc) got it running great. It drives pretty good. But still clutch problems. It will slip if I'm going straight with the bucket down trying to dig. It gives a shudder of the clutch slipping.
Now I know that we didn't use the special tool lavoy sells to set the finger height. But would that effect the clutches holding pressure or just it's releasing? I'm thinking this is my problem but I guess I just want to hear I'm not pulling the motor again for no reason.

Also it seems I might have a slipping steering clutch also. But I think that will be easier to diagnose with the engine clutch not slipping.

And last but not least can someone explain a power reverser to me? I think I have one. Right beside the gear shifter?


Thanks a ton for the help everyone and for the parts Lavoy.

[Lavoy]

Not adjusting the pressure plate fingers can result in inadequte surface pressure, and will result in incorrect finger height, and most likely less clutch life.
That being said, normally they will still pull even if you don't adjust them. Do you have enough freeplay in the clutch, that is what I would check first.
The lever by the shifter is for the PTO.
Lavoy

[Paulywally]

Lavoy, I adjusted the clutch pedal so it essentially does nothing and only starts to push the clutch at the very bottom of its travel because I also thought this was the problem. It didn't help at all.

Is there any way to distinguish between the engine clutch slipping and the steering clutches? I guess it would be pretty rare for both of them to start slipping at the same time but I'm just thinking out loud here. I wonder does anyone know if you can take the inspection covers off the steering clutch area and see slippage vs not turning at all meaning that my problem is still with the engine clutch?

Thanks for the views and the reply Lavoy.

[Lavoy]

If you have a PTO, put the PTO in gear, and watch it as the crawler stops. If it is the engine clutch, the PTO will stop turning.
Lavoy

[Paulywally]

What a great idea Lavoy. I never thought of that. I think there is a cover over the pto output. Should be as simple as removing it?

[gus]

If the PTO doesn't run at all, maybe splines on the drive shaft gone?? The one I took apart, the splines looked like they would have lasted another 10' or 10 min, which ever came first.

[Paulywally]

Thanks for the reply Gus. Too me the crawler it works too well for the splines to be stripped. It will drive and even move a bit of mud but of you try to work it too hard it slips. It definetly seems like a clutch slipping. But I've never encountered a crawler with stripped splines so I'm not sure.


Lavoy in your first post you said not adjusting the pressure plate fingers will result in inadequate surface pressure. Are you referring to the holding like not released pressure of the clutch? If you are I'm going to say this is definetly my problem.

[Lavoy]

The farther out the fingers are from their proper position, the less surface pressure the pressure plate has. As I said though, this is typically not an issue on a new pressure plate, you will just likley have less clutch life as the throwout bearing will run out of adjustment sooner than it should.
Yes, pull the bottom 3 bolt cover and have someone watch the shaft as you are pushing.
Lavoy