Looking for newer crawler

[eidolon]

My 1975 350B with 6 way is getting tired and I am getting tired of spending 8 -16 hours maintenance for every hour of work it gives me. More disturbing is the additional 4 hours of internet research I spend every time looking to replace an "obsolete" part. JD has a standing policy of discontinuing any part after 15 years if there is no longer significant demand (according to my parts person). Since I still need a dozer around the farm (very badly, actually) I am looking at some newer alternatives. The 450G and the Cat 3B are both on my radar. I don't really relish the idea of adding 5000 pounds to my tired equipment trailer and old dump truck, but it seems American manufacturers haven't seen a market for dozers in the 10,000 pound range for 20-30 years. Only the Japanese seem to dabble in that market these days, but (other than the D3 which is made in Japan, but supported by Cat) I'm not sure I want to deal with a foreign made machine. Anyone have any experience or insights on the 450G or D3B?

[Lavoy]

Not a comment on either of the two you listed, but a tired crawler is a tired crawler, regardless of age. If one of the two you list is tired, you will still be fixing, that will never change.
As to your parts man's comment, I disagree to some degree, but regardless, Deere in that regard is no different than any other manufacturer. No one stocks a part with limited inventory turn other than fools like me.
I also wonder what part it is for a 350 that you can't find. I have availability on an awful lot of 350 parts.
Lavoy

[eidolon]

It was the clutch linkage we just talked about in another post. According to my parts guy, the AT 17364 ball joint /adjustment link is obsolete and was replaced with the newer 317916 which has the wrong thread pitch. He says the newer part is being maintained by JD only because it is also used on some newer dozers - albeit not in the clutch linkage. Apparently, their engineers looked at the 2 parts and didn't catch the difference in thread pitch - so they thought it was a suitable replacement. While I was talking to him, I also checked on the coupling sleeve PN AT 17365 - which (fortunately) I don't yet need. He tells me there is only one of those left in the Deere inventory (or in the world) down in Atlanta. $87. Better get it while you can if you think you may need one! I also own an old International 500E (same year as the 350B) and I can no longer find certain vital parts for it ANYWHERE. It is now parked and rusting. I could find parts a few years ago, but no longer. I can manufacture some things, but that is even more time consuming. (Ask me about the starter I just replaced on the 350 if you want another tale of woe.) In short, it works well, but the new one is 1/2 inch longer than the old one and wouldn't fit with the mechanical fuel pump. I replaced same with an electric pump and had to re-plumb and wire it. Another 1.5 work days shot! Oh well, crab, crab, crab! Glad to know you have parts for the 350's. May have to consult you more.

[Lavoy]

IH has been sold too many times to find much, but I do have some availability for them. Dresser dealer might be able to help you some too.
Lavoy

[Tigerhaze]

Here are some threads for the 450G; people generally like them I think. The guys in these threads (Digitup2, Jason, etc.) are commercial users so their opinion is valuable.

http://www.jdcrawlers.com/messageboard/ ... light=450g

http://www.jdcrawlers.com/messageboard/ ... light=450g

http://www.jdcrawlers.com/messageboard/ ... light=450g

http://www.jdcrawlers.com/messageboard/ ... light=450g

http://www.jdcrawlers.com/messageboard/ ... sc&start=0

http://www.jdcrawlers.com/messageboard/ ... light=450g

[eidolon]

Thanks for feedback. Very helpful. I am trying to confine my search to newer used machines(late 80s or 90s) with 3000 hours or less - so I don't have to immediately enter the overhaul phase.

[LeonardL]

I understand your dilemma and also understand your frustration with an older piece of equipment. I have enough experience with the Cat D3's to know that you will not be happy with any that are older than the "D3C". Personally I do not like these machines but that is just my personal preference. I would buy a Case before I would buy a Japanese version of a Caterpillar. They are hard to work on and about double in parts cost overall. Under carriage and that sort of thing you can buy after market the same as any other manufacturer. But machine parts are expensive and in a lot of cases non existent especially on the older machines. I'm not bashing Caterpillar. I like Cat for the most part. I just don't like these particular machines. The 450G is one tough and reliable machine. In my estimation it is one of Deere's best machines. We had very little trouble out them. I will have to agree with what has already been said about an old tired machine. It can be relatively new and be tired. You have the right idea in finding one with low hours if you can. The Deere "G" models are getting harder to find with low hours on them. That being said I would buy a Deere "G" model with twice the hours on it before I would buy a Cat D3 with low hours. Just my thoughts and good luck with what ever you buy.

[eidolon]

Lots of good feedback here. The 450G looks better all the time. I notice their price reflects their popularity too. I also discovered a Komatsu 31e with 3600 hours for under 15K. anyone have experience with that one?

[jtb51b]

i have used a Komatsu D21p machine a few times in the past. Other than my 350b its the only small machine I have used. The one I used was smaller than the 31 you are looking at but was a very nice machine. I cleared a mobile home pad with that machine and it did extremely well. I wouldnt hesitate to buy a komatsu machine personally. I have no idea regarding parts availability.

Jason

[Tigerhaze]

One thing I would point out about Komatsu's and other Japanese crawlers is that some of them are "grey market" machines- that means they weren't originally intended for import to the U.S. While they generally aren't too abused (Japanese are very good about maintenance and selling with low hours), they do not always have OSHA required features if they are to be used commercially. Also sometimes parts availability can be tough although on the Komatsu's I believe there is some availability for parts over other brands. I have a couple grey market machines and the toughest thing is that the instruction labels on the machine are in Japanese.

[eidolon]

Yes, I am well familiar with gray market tractors and dozers. I have a Yanmar tractor that is gray market. an excellent machine, BTW. The trick is not to tip the US dealer off that you are looking for a part for a gray market machine. They will practically chase you out of the store. Especially a gray market Kubota! Kubota actually got a law passed making it illegal to import gray market tractors of their brand, but a few still show up. If you think you may have a gray market item (but don't know for sure) do your research on what may be different about your item from the US brand and don't go looking for a part that is not on a US model. There are a number of gray market web sites with helpful people on this subject, and some of them sell parts.