Steering problems 350b

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jwiles58
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Steering problems 350b

Post by jwiles58 » Mon Mar 13, 2017 7:18 am

Bought a 350b that just had the right side steering clutch rebuilt. Lasted about two days and quit pulling on the right side. Pulled it down and the friction plates are totally destroyed. Any ideas on what happened?


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Lavoy
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Post by Lavoy » Mon Mar 13, 2017 3:09 pm

Improper installation, bad pilot bearing, pilot bearing mounting stud broken off, just some guesses.
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jwiles58
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Post by jwiles58 » Mon Mar 13, 2017 8:08 pm

If the clutch failed to release and the brake was
Applied could this destruction result?

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Stan Disbrow
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Post by Stan Disbrow » Tue Mar 14, 2017 6:42 am

Hi,

Well, you would be putting a lot of load on them like that. That amount of damage makes me think those are the kind of parts made from the wrong material, though. Most of what you see offered online these days seem to have issues....

Stan
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Post by Lavoy » Tue Mar 14, 2017 1:53 pm

No, clutch will hold 100% engine power whether at full traction or clutch not releasing. If, however, there was an error in installation, then possibly.
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Last edited by Lavoy on Wed Mar 22, 2017 2:06 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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jsal
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Post by jsal » Wed Mar 15, 2017 4:45 pm

looks to me like the guy you bought it from was full of s**t when he said it it had been rebuilt they are totally wasted !!!! what do the metal discs look like


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Post by original possum » Wed Mar 22, 2017 1:13 pm

Check the condition of the splines on the hub, too.
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Post by Lavoy » Wed Mar 22, 2017 2:08 pm

My money is on faulty rebuild, possibly another underlying issue, but still fault of rebuilder. Fix all the problems while you are in there.
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jwiles58
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Post by jwiles58 » Wed Mar 22, 2017 5:01 pm

Ok. Replaced fiber and steel pates. Adjusted pressure plate finger to correct
Height. Repaired throw out bearing linkage and adjusted per repair manual. Seems to be working great. Hopefully longer than the previous repair. Thanks to everyone for their help and advise.

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Re: Steering problems 350b

Post by hdokes » Thu Jul 27, 2017 7:39 pm

Greetings all,

I'm a newbie to crawler talk and not sure if it's ok to piggy back on this thread or if I should have started a new one. Also I am a newbie to a '73 JD350b-b I acquired in an auction a couple weeks ago. I can't complain to much regarding the issues I'm faced with as I only paid $1950.00 for the crawler and upon initial inspection found that it is clean, runs great, no major damage, and goes forward and reverse (with reverser) smooth as silk. The issue I have is a lack of any brakes and no left or right steering. The dozer was purchased by the previous owner for a single construction job and when complete it sat outside since that time for at least 6 months and probably a lot longer than that. The previous owner did show me video's on his phone of the dozer being completely operational including turning with ease and braking so I have to conclude that the clutches have froze into place since it goes forward and backward without issue and that the brakes are just completely out of adjustment.

I have combed through these threads and garnered some information and tricks to try to break the steering loose however none have resulted in any success. The following are steps I have already tried.

1. Working the steering handles while going back and forth for a couple hours
2. Pushing up against a tree and working the steering handles while trying to move forward
3. Insuring that the clutch cavity was clear of water (found drain plugs to be missing)
4. Put replacement drain plugs in and filled with Kerosene and let sit over night.
5. Rinse and repeat 1 and 2.

So.... after hours of all that... I have resolved myself to digging in and replacing the steering clutches along with the brake bands and getting everything dialled in. I'm quite fortunate in that I have a wonderful facility to do the work in and have already gotten everything in place and set up. I have also already purchased a complete set of JD manuals for it to include the parts, operations & maintenance, and service manuals. Call me crazy (my wife does) but I'm really actually exited about going through these motions. My approach is to pull it all apart first and find out what all I actually have to purchase. I also have an inclination to record the entire process and put it up on youtube as I have not been able to find ANY video of such work thus far as it relates to a jd350 or 350b . I have found a couple here that have been through the motions but it appears most of the provided pics by one are missing and jwiles58 stating only that he went through it all... which..... brings me here....

I currently have the dozer blocked up and off the ground. I have identified the master pins in the tracks however I have not found anything yet that suggests how one man might get them off. I will digress a bit and volunteer that as a teenager I cut a 3/4 mile road through wooded parcels with a JD2010 with a clam shell loader and backhoe my dad owned. I have a LOT of hours on that thing. One major problem it had was the left side track was always loose and if you hit a stump or rock just right the track would jump off the idler. I can't tell you the number of times as a kid I was out in the middle of no where by my lonesome in Montana putting that damn thing back on with only a pry bar and sheer will! It would take me an hour to do so and I would be completely exhausted (to the point of collapsing) afterwards before I could get up enough energy to get back on and try not to do it all over again. So here I am at nearly 59 having flashbacks.

My question here is, can any one suggest or point me to any location (internet) that shows the removal of at least the tracks and possibly the entire removal and replacement of the steering clutches? I have no issues attacking the job in the absence of this but.... why re-invent the wheel? Also, since I expect that I will not only have many more questions as I get into this, and that I'd like to document the process through these forums for any other soul who has determined that their life just can't be fulfilled unless they to decide to participate in such an endeavour of their own, should I ask the moderator to move this reply to a new thread with a title such as..... "Resurrecting a 350b"? There are other cosmetic type issues I will be looking to correct such as all the dash guages are long since non-functional and I would like to find a source for the original type gauges (those with jd green colouring within them) to replace them with as an example.
Last edited by hdokes on Fri Jul 28, 2017 7:36 am, edited 1 time in total.
Leverage, it's what's for dinner! :idea:

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Re: Steering problems 350b

Post by Lavoy » Fri Jul 28, 2017 7:35 am

Get a factory parts and service manual, they are the best references to have while doing the job. Check everything out while you are in there. Clean, anti-seize, and adjust everything. I would check pinion shaft seal and bearings while the final is off too.
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hdokes
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Re: Steering problems 350b

Post by hdokes » Fri Jul 28, 2017 8:04 am

Hello Lavoy,

I'm pleased to see your response here. As I have sifted through these threads I've seen your comments sprinkled through out and have learned much from them already.

I added to my post above that I did indeed already purchase a full set of manuals. The problem is they assume you have the luxury of the entire arsenal of equipment John Deere has to offer to do the repairs... i.e. the hydraulic pin remover that costs more than I paid for the entire crawler. Further, the purchase of much of it can be little justified when it's likely to be a one time use.

I am also fortunate that I have created a 16,000 sq. ft. proto typing shop and can create almost everything my little pea brain can come up with. I am not adverse to 'making' the tools required to do the job if I have an inclination as to what form they should take.

I have plenty of hydraulic rams and the like and have been mulling over how I might attach one to some kind of industrial 'c' clamp. I do also own both manual and cnc milling machines along with a few lathes and have been considering how I might fabricate such a 'c' clamp but uncertain of the forces needed to break the pin loose.
Leverage, it's what's for dinner! :idea:

60 Cat D6B dozer
?? JD 350b crawler/loader
02 JD 260 Skid Steer
68 Case 580CK diesel w/backhoe
67 Case 580CK Gas w/backhoe
81 JLG S35 scissor lift
Clark C500-70, C500-30, GCX40 forklifts
81 Intl 1854 dump

dtoots1
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Re: Steering problems 350b

Post by dtoots1 » Fri Jul 28, 2017 9:36 am

to hdokes,

i have posted what i did with my jd440....tracks were last worked on 20 years ago!...

First of all....i only weigh 140lbs....left steering went out and i needed to get her off.....so i got her up and moved track with come along to 1 or 2 o'clock position on the sprocket.....found it best to remove 2 of the shoes at the master pin....swung the long handle sledge....no good swing....then started with a short handle 3 lb sledge and noticed enough movement in the link to cause binding.....took track shoe on inside and place right at shoulder of pin clamp with bolt thru shoe hole and 1/2 x 1 1/2 bar on other side to eliminate binding.....smacked good with the short handle sledge and see movement....oil her up good and continue till get loose....pin still in outer link but at least out of way... started out using heat on pin shoulder which may well have helped but never could get it really hot too much iron....

found out pressure plate collapsed and brake band itself broken in half!

parts are due to arrive today to get clutch and brake back in..

good luck
dtoots1

hdokes
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Re: Steering problems 350b

Post by hdokes » Fri Jul 28, 2017 11:04 am

ahhhhh.... to be 140 lbs again. I've blossomed over the years to a shapely 240lbs. Fortunately I'm 6' tall and it's all mid section but it still drives me nuts.

Ok.... first, thanks for responding dtoots1, I really appreciate it. I have found your posts and am going through them now. Can I assume you didn't have any pics to post?

One thing I have noticed is that I have a canopy on my 350b which is mounted to supports that bolt to the back side of the final drive assembly on both sides and I will have to remove all of that first so my work is already cut out for me. I have read that if one doesn't have the hydraulic pin punch tool that it may be easier to leave the pads bolted up when wailing on the pin for added 'support'. Did you have much movement of the linkage on the impact stroke that otherwise hindered it's breaking loose?
Leverage, it's what's for dinner! :idea:

60 Cat D6B dozer
?? JD 350b crawler/loader
02 JD 260 Skid Steer
68 Case 580CK diesel w/backhoe
67 Case 580CK Gas w/backhoe
81 JLG S35 scissor lift
Clark C500-70, C500-30, GCX40 forklifts
81 Intl 1854 dump

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Re: Steering problems 350b

Post by Lavoy » Fri Jul 28, 2017 3:13 pm

Never pull the pad when sledge hammering the master pin out, it usually bends or breaks the other half of the link. Heat on the links will expand them slightly and let the pin slide out easier. But, if you have a torch, my favorite is eat into both ends of the master pin with the torch being careful not to cut into the link itself. Let it cool, and the pin will come right out. Master pins are cheap, chiropractor appts. are not. You are probably in the 30 ton minimum range to get the master pin out.
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