'73 - 450B Crawler/Loader/Hoe Restoration

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cordlesscarpenter
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Re: '73 - 450B Crawler/Loader/Hoe Restoration

Post by cordlesscarpenter » Fri Aug 27, 2021 2:51 pm

Cool, I'll keep posting then. I'd add photos but it's a royal pain in the butt to add photos. So if you want photos or would like some advise, just send me a message with your email and I'll help ya out best I can.

cordlesscarpenter
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Re: '73 - 450B Crawler/Loader/Hoe Restoration

Post by cordlesscarpenter » Fri Aug 27, 2021 4:27 pm

cordlesscarpenter wrote:
Thu Aug 26, 2021 2:58 pm
Was looking back on another thread where I asked about a 4219 - 4039 swap and remembered seeing where Jim B mentioned that there might be a problem with that little power steering pump but back then I didn't really understand the system like I do now. Funny thing is... now that I already have an engine, I found a couple good 4219s and 4239s... I guess that's how it goes.

Got me wondering now, whether the the front plate from a 4219 or 4239 will fit a 4039 AND what else I'd have to swap to the 4039... I imagine the gear train is not set up for a power steering pump since they never came from the factory that way (or did some?) hmmm.

Well, back to the undercarriage ripout... good times. fall can't come fast enough!

Is anyone even reading these posts?

Sorry, this was suppose to be an edit, not a quote lol
Last edited by cordlesscarpenter on Sat Aug 28, 2021 11:38 am, edited 1 time in total.

cordlesscarpenter
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Re: '73 - 450B Crawler/Loader/Hoe Restoration

Post by cordlesscarpenter » Fri Aug 27, 2021 4:52 pm

Jason, if you're out there... do you know if the front plate will swap over from 4219 or 4239 to a 4039? And what else would be involved? I figure if anyone on here has done it, it's probably you.

Well, Today's progress has been slow but steady, got all 4 rock rails off which was not as easy as it sound... my poor impact wrench was cussing at me, I swear if it had a face, I know exactly what expression it would be giving me and exactly what words would be coming out of his mouth haha. Got her re-leveled the old girl on her jacks stands (she was saggin' a bit to the right), drained the transmission, cleaned the strainer and put all that back together (thankfully there was no metal chunks or random parts in there (yup, I've had that experience before lol) and ordered all new fasteners and spacers for the rock rails from Fastenal in town (those 9" grade 8 carriage bolts are not cheap).

Well, the cool off break is over, I best get back at it while there's still sun (and no skeeters)...

Funny side note, I'm doing all this in a temporary shelter I built between two trees and a cargo container. I milled up some lumber and thrrough a roof together and sheeted it with some used tin... now I have a squirrel who is having hickory nuts for breakfast, lunch and dinner so I have to listen to little pieces of hickory nuts hitting the roof all day and when a whole nut slipps out of his hands and hits the roof it startles me half to death! Until I get some new rubber for my slingshot anyways hehe.

JWB Contracting
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Re: '73 - 450B Crawler/Loader/Hoe Restoration

Post by JWB Contracting » Sat Aug 28, 2021 2:53 pm

I did not know if the covers swap over, there is a good chance. I have the benefit of sheds full of parts and a 75 year old dad who does the majority of the engine and component rebuilds.

We just did a 350B dozer, full strip including undercarriage. Only thing not touched was the rear end / transmission. No paint and all used parts and turned out real nice.

I’m just the purchaser and salesman now as only get out to the farm one day a week if that.

Tomorrow is caterpillar day. Dozer to mount on a D5H, assess 3204 for rebuild for a D3, and hopefully sell a D4D widepad. Do have some Deere stuff lined up for rebuilds, but not everything has been picked up or delivered yet.
Jason Benesch

John Deere 420, 430, 440 & 350C With 3 Point Hitch
John Deere 400G With Winch
John Deere 2010 Crawler Dozer
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cordlesscarpenter
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Re: '73 - 450B Crawler/Loader/Hoe Restoration

Post by cordlesscarpenter » Sat Aug 28, 2021 5:47 pm

Thanks Jason. I might give it a go if the parts are cheap enough and or returnable, the last thing I want to do is collect parts I can't use.

Got a lot accomplished today, removed all 10 lower rollers and both idlers. Doesn't sound like much when I write it out but believe me, it wasn't as easy as it sounds haha.

Tomorrow will be removing the upper idler rollers and pulling the top off the front of the trans to inspect. Then... it time to prep for paint...

Got a bunch of parts in today so I've gotta sort through all that too.

Not much beats an honest, hard and productive day of turning wrenches.

cordlesscarpenter
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Re: '73 - 450B Crawler/Loader/Hoe Restoration

Post by cordlesscarpenter » Mon Aug 30, 2021 9:23 pm

Got both upper idler rollers off and bagged and got both track adjuster piston/yoke assemblies removed. One of the assemblies was stuck and required hours of brute manipulation to get it out safely. need to find my grease fittings so I can pop out the pistons and get the correct new ones on order (need to know the current length)

Tried to remove the front trans cover for inspection but in order to do that I have to remove the power steering block with the booster cylinders and all which I have ready to pull but the left side yoke that attaches the cylinder to the steering stick is seized on there and everything I'm throwing at it is proving unsuccessful. I've got it propped up with steel between the yoke and the frame and double beefy wedges from the other side beating the snot out of it and it is not responding in the slightest. I'm hitting it hard enough that I worry something may break off... It just laughed at my vise grips, laughed at trying to pop it with a pry bar, laughed at punch and hammer... so I sent it to bed with a good helping of penetrating oil to think about what it did and hopefully tomorrow it seeks forgiveness and breaks free... well, as long as the stinkin hurricane doesn't flood me out first.

cordlesscarpenter
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Re: '73 - 450B Crawler/Loader/Hoe Restoration

Post by cordlesscarpenter » Wed Sep 01, 2021 3:47 pm

Had an awesome day so far! Yesterday I rebuilt the two hydraulic angle cylinders on my TD-8E (with 6-way) and spent the morning installing those... turned out perfectly and the dozer is back in the dirt with no leaks, then I popped back into the tent to attack the power steering block on the 450B... Finally got the yoke pin free, power steering block removed and popped the top on the front of the transmission. If I didn't know any better, I'd swear I was it was 1973, it was THAT clean and unmolested in there, just like the rear half of the trans. I didn't pull and separate the clutch packs or anything but I imagine they are in great shape with lots of life left in them. I was soooo excited to see such a healthy transmission! I shifted through the gears and rolled the trans in neutral. This project has been one heck of a challenge but it's gonna be so worth it in the end... new to me 4039DF (turbo), new engine clutch (not yet installed), beautiful transmission front and back, fully rebuilt steering clutches, beautiful final drives (although I do have a FD rebuild kit on hand for when they do finally need it), Like new sprockets, new bottom and top track rollers, New Idlers, new 9/16" hardware for 37 link SALT chain with new 14" 3 bar loader pads (with clean-outs!), new track adjuster pistons and seals (not yet installed), ALL new hydraulic hoses for the loader and the backhoe. I am finally at the point to start prepping for paint! well, once I button the trans back up.

I did have a question for you guys, although the trans looks beautiful, there is a tiny film of oily sludge on the bottom. Half of me says don't worry about it because you'll never get it all without pulling all the guts out and the other half says throw a quart or two of fresh HyGard at it to try and flush it best I can, thoughts???

cordlesscarpenter
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Re: '73 - 450B Crawler/Loader/Hoe Restoration

Post by cordlesscarpenter » Mon Sep 06, 2021 3:26 pm

Got both front and rear of the transmission all buttoned up and started on prep for paint. Unfortunately this step is going to take some time as I don't own an outdoor media blaster nor do I wish to deal with all the mess and fuss. I did get the power steering block all cleaned up and mating surfaces primed... headed out to bolt that back into place and hook everything back up including the steering sticks (so I can pull them back to their stowed position).

cordlesscarpenter
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Re: '73 - 450B Crawler/Loader/Hoe Restoration

Post by cordlesscarpenter » Thu Sep 16, 2021 4:14 pm

The JD 4039DF001 engine I got to put in place of the roached one would most likely work as far as machine power (and frankly, I was looking forward to the power upgrade) BUT it is clearly not going to work with the power steering pump without some major modifications. So I started looking into it and I may be in a deal to basically swap engines with my salvage guy for a 4239 (or maybe a 4219, he has a few engines). The good news is that I would have the correct engine with the power steering pump on the front because it came out of a 450B and it already has the main hyd pump drive which I was still lacking. The better news is that one of them is in the shop getting a complete overhaul on it right now so I would be starting out with a fresh engine. Albeit someone else is doing the rebuild and you never know what you're really getting but I also realize that's all part of the game.

I've also been making great progress on the paint prep and will laying down the first section of paint tomorrow. I'm doing it in sections to try and alleviate getting all the work done to have to start over because it started rusting again lol.

If anyone wants pics, just message me your email and I'll add it to a distro list and shoot out updates.

cordlesscarpenter
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Re: '73 - 450B Crawler/Loader/Hoe Restoration

Post by cordlesscarpenter » Sat Oct 02, 2021 9:57 am

Amongst the rest of life's daily responsibilities and challenges, I have been making super progress in the prep and paint arena. So far I've managed to get all 4 deckplates, seat bracket, track adjusters, the loader frame, loader arms and cylinders, skid plate and hood all properly prepped and painted. I'm using all the right stuff too so It's going on really well. I'm using JD Old Construction Yellow (on my second gallon now) and it's being mixed with 16:1 hardener then 10% JD thinner and applied with a Devilbiss FLG4 HLVP cup gun (borrowed from a buddy). I've never been a cup gun guy, always preferred rolling and brushing but I must say, it is much faster and goes on more consistently... might even be using less paint which is good because JD paint is not cheap. The worst part about spray guns is all the masking off and cleaning the gun but overall not a bad experience. I may even use the gun to give my TD-8E a quickie facelift, he needs it like something fierce! Next batch is Rock guards and front grill cowling... Hope all is well with everyone out there!

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DrLoch
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Re: '73 - 450B Crawler/Loader/Hoe Restoration

Post by DrLoch » Sun Oct 03, 2021 7:27 am

Great progress. Cleaning the spray guns is a pain in the who who but must get done.
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cordlesscarpenter
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Re: '73 - 450B Crawler/Loader/Hoe Restoration

Post by cordlesscarpenter » Tue Oct 12, 2021 10:03 pm

Nothing but a crap ton of wire wheeling/sanding and painting going on, since last update, I have painted the front grill/cowling, sprockets, weights, fuel tank, rock guards, backhoe bracket and a bunch of little odds and ends. Next up are the battery and hyd boxes, then the main body. Hoping to get the backhoe and 4-in-1 Drott bucket done before it gets too cold but they may have to wait until the machine is operational so I can use the crawler itself to move them into the paint booth that I can heat.

The engine swap is still being hashed out along with a bunch of other salvage parts (should be the last of all the parts I need) but should be heading out to pick all that up in Nov sometime, until then I'll have the entire undercarriage along with the cockpit to assemble, so no shortage of things to do. The goal is to have her up and running by December but more realistically before the holidays.

Cheers everyone!

cordlesscarpenter
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Re: '73 - 450B Crawler/Loader/Hoe Restoration

Post by cordlesscarpenter » Sun Oct 17, 2021 8:07 pm

Both boxes are ready for paint in the morning along with the show side of the sprocket weights, sprockets, tank. Bunch of misc. piping and smaller bits and bobs are probably next but I'd sure like to get the main body started before vacation down south... The weather is starting to turn so It's go time!

Although I've restored side boxes in the past, the boxes were by far the worst with regards to 40 years of caked on grease and many years of corrosion but the metal was still good and solid, primed it with heavy rust primer and should be some of the prettier components of the machine by this time tomorrow. Glad that is over

cordlesscarpenter
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Re: '73 - 450B Crawler/Loader/Hoe Restoration

Post by cordlesscarpenter » Sun Oct 24, 2021 9:47 am

Got the last shoot done on the show side of the sprockets, weights and boxes... the boxes turned out beautifully with the exception of one wrinkle but I decided to leave it there because the rest turned out so good and it will remain a steadfast reminder of the perfect imperfection that we all share, to one degree or another. I also decided to Herculine the inside of the battery box like I have on other machines, it tends to work best since it is also used for storage of tools, chains, etc. I did received my 450B decal kit but I think I'll wait until the end to apply them.

Soon I'll be headed south to spend time with family but when I get back, I have a run to make to upstate NY to swap engines (from the 4039 I have but wont work with this machine, to the 4219 with aux pump that WILL work with this machine) and load up on all the other remaining parts I need to finish this old girl off through the fall/winter.

Cheers!

cordlesscarpenter
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Re: '73 - 450B Crawler/Loader/Hoe Restoration

Post by cordlesscarpenter » Wed Nov 17, 2021 10:10 pm

UPDATE:

Besides the main body (which is underway), the meat of the painting is done. I will still have the hoe, and the 4-in-1 bucket to get done once the machine is driven out of the paint booth but I've gotten the vast majority done... oh yeah, and the parts I bring back from NY on Friday

I have also begun swapping out hydraulic hoses as I am having them all rebuilt over the next few months

Lastly, I have the 4039T all loaded up on the truck and headed to NY tomorrow morning to swap that engine for the correct engine and pick up a ton of other parts.

I have decided to go ahead and rebuild the engine before I stab it in... it's the only logical choice. I just need to decide whether to do it myself or have my local guy do it so I can concentrate on the rest of the build.

Next step is to finish off the body prep and paint and begin assembly. :D

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