JD 450 in Sweden

[digitup]

All you can do is set the adjustment that the clutch will release completely and work it some more if there is an area that you can work the hell out of it than do so .Make sure that the linkage is all working good and the other side should loosen as well. Good luck.Digitup.

[wwattson]

Ulf,

I would have to say that you are doing very well to have gotten it to work as well as you have working outside this time of year.

I have a 1010 that had a similar problem with the steering clutch. What causing the swelling was the rusting of the steel disks and not actual swelling of the fiber disks. I believe that digitup is completely correct that if there is any way to resolve the issue without disassembly, it would be by loosening everything as far as you can and working it to free the stuck parts.

The nice thing about where you've got it is that you can now drive it and steer it on the one working clutch. I made an entire dressage riding arena with my crawler with only one working steering clutch. If you need to trailer it to a different location for the winter or otherwise need to move it to an easier place to work on it, you can now turn both directions. The opposite direction is always in reverse.

Wish I could come over and help you. Sounds like a great find and you're doing really well with it.

[digitup]

Some times you would like to reach inside and just whack it with a hammer on the clutch housing a good jolt may just smarten it up .Digitup.

[D557017]

Hello, when i worked on the machine yesterday i had a piece of round metal and a hammer to knock on the left side clutch with.
I found a stone almost as big as the machine that i drove up against with the front bucket, and as i said before i had the clutch "overadjusted" but even though i had the steering lever pulled back as far as it possibly can come, the left side tracks just kept turning with the machine bouncing against the big stone.
So i think i have ruled out violence as a solution, i am afrain that i will break something if i get more brutal.
I had a talk with Bertas owner, and he said that he would be ok with the steering as it is for the work he has to do.
He also said that the left side steering hadn`t worked 100% for as long as he has owned the machine, in fact, it had gradualy gotten worse and worse the more he used it, wouldn´t that talk against rust being the problem?
I shoud also propably mention that when i say that the left side clutch looks thicker, i would estemate more then a 1/4 inch.

Ulf.

P.S i found that the tag on the dashboard is for the loader

[Lupusrex]

Hi Ulf,

I´m in the process of bringing home a JD450 with the same spec as yours from an old farmer not far from me in Gothenburg. If you´re interested I´d be happy to lend you the tech manual and the parts book that I got for free (from the JD Forest Machine agent, great people)some years ago when I started to discuss with the farmer.
I´ve read all the great messages here from your story and It looks as if I´m on the same route to getting mine to work. According to the JD Sweden represenative in Malmo, you should be able to buy any part related to the machine through your local JD agent, provided they have access to the parts database.
Anyway,
PM me your phone no and I´ll call you to discuss.

BR/Lupusrex

[D557017]

Another 450 in Sweden, very interesting.
Maybe you have found a better JD dealer then i managed to, the ones i talked to knew nothing about crawlers.
A PM is on the way.

Ulf

[D557017]

Hello everybody, can`t wait until spring so i can finaly take the 450 home and do some work on it. Anyway, just wanted to say: Merry Christmas and happy new year!

[D557017]

Hello, can`t belive it`s been a year since last, time has gone by realy fast.
I took the 450 home in the spring as planned, but due to other projects like getting my garage in order, finishing my father in laws Oliver OC3 etcetera the repair of the steering system has not begun until just the last few days.
I have visitided this forum at least once a week though, picking up som useful information here and there.
I wanted to post a picture of my machine but i dont know how, could someone explain it to me in simple terms?

[jdemaris]

Hello digitup and everyone else, when searching the internet for parts by
I have a German spare parts list for the injectionpump and by the picture in it the pump is definetly a Robert Bosch

Deere used Stanadyne/Roosamaster pumps in the Americas. But, at one time Stanadyne pumps were not allowed in other countries. That because Stanadyne sold rights to Lucas, Bosch, CAV and Diesel Kiki to copy the USA pump and make their own versions. So, yeah - US tractors overseas use different pumps.

Early 450Bs had no turbos, only the late ones did.

In the USA, a 450 used the 202 engine. There were two versions of the 202, and you have the second version - same as used in late-model 2020 and 2510 ag tractors. You have the block that takes two seal rings, and a sleeve that takes one.

About what others stated about 202s not being good cold starters. Not true. Some were excellent starters and some were not. That because of wide and sloppy assembly tolerances. And, that carried all the way up to the C series before it got corrected. We had more cold starting problems with new Cs than anything made before. Some old 450s with 202s as well as 350s with 152s will outstart many newer machines.

[D557017]

Made an attempt at posting a picture, didn`t work very well, help!!!!!

About cold starting, i bought parts to install "thermostart" in the intake manifold of my 450.
Now there is just a metal pipe leading to under the dashboard, for eterstart perhaps?

[jdemaris]

Made an attempt at posting a picture, didn`t work very well, help!!!!!

About cold starting, i bought parts to install "thermostart" in the intake manifold of my 450.
Now there is just a metal pipe leading to under the dashboard, for eterstart perhaps?

Deere 350s and 450s usually had an ether injector. Small jet screwed into the air-intake, hooked to a small line that ran to the a recepticle under the dashboard. Has a thread-on cap. You remove the cap, stick the end of a standard ether can into it (after you pull off the spray nozzle), and then - jam it upwards while cranking.

About cold starting. Some of the early 350s and 450s were excellent cold starters. Deere used very wide and sloppy tolerances at the engine factory. Very wide range of plusses and minuses. So, if you happened to get an engine that had parts at the best end of the tolerance scale- it would start right down to zero without a block heater or ether. If you got one with sloppy tolerances, it would barely start at 40-50 degrees above F.

It became a big problem for us when the C series of crawlers came out, and the 40 series of Ag tractors came out. Most were terrible starters - sloppiest Deere had built in a long time. So, we'd have a customer trading in an old Deere 350 that always started great. He'd pick up a new 350C and it would barely start at 50 F degrees - and then when it did - it would skip, sputter, smoke, etc. until it got good and warm. We had many complaints over that. It was this mess that forced Deere to do something. After many failed attempts by Deere to fix, they finally came out with upgraded pistons with higher rings.

Generally speaking, an old 350 or 450 that started well when new, will always start well as long as you don't screw up the cylinder head when doing a valve job. Valve depth-in-head is critical. Once you grind a valve seat, and reface a valve, the finished job will have valves that sit too deep in the head.

Sometime - with the late Cs as I recall, they came through with French-built engines - made in Saran. They ALL started great.

With ag tractors - the 40 series was the worst ever for cold starting and most were German built. When the 50 series came out, they all were great starters.

About your crawler - what exact injection pump model does it have? I've always wondered about some of this stuff overseas. Like I said earlier, at one time, Stanadyne/Roosamaster pumps were NOT allowed in Europe, and European CAVs, Lucas and Bosch rotaries were not allowed in the USA. But, I know some of those original contract agreements have changed or expired. A guy in the USA invented that basic rotary pump - Veron Roosa. His company, which was Hartridge Tool, and later became Stanadyne/Moen Faucets - sold rights to European pump companies to copy it and build their own versions. All those Rotodiesels, CAVs, Lucas-Bosch rotaries were based on that license to copy.

[D557017]

Hello jdemaris, and thank you for your answer.
What would you like to know about my pump except that it`s a Robert Bosch?

PS. i would take a picture of it and post if i only knew how!

PS. 2 : Merry christmas everyone!

[KenP]

deleted

[jdemaris]

Hello jdemaris, and thank you for your answer.
What would you like to know about my pump except that it`s a Robert Bosch?

PS. i would take a picture of it and post if i only knew how!

PS. 2 : Merry christmas everyone!

I don't know all the ways to post photos - but I find using a free host works fine.

I just put these on to photobucket.com, then posted them here with the
"image" code. Every forum is different. Some want "image" code, some "HTML", etc.

[digitup2]

Just so you know Bosch and Robert Bosch are two different entities as well .Robert Bosch is North American Market injector system components .Bosch is European built systems .So that pump was still made in North America and sent over on that crawler unit . Deere and many other engine manufacturers installed fuel injection systems built by different manufacturers and they sent quite a few different builds of injectors and pumps to Canada where we got the best and worst of the lot .In the seventy's 350D and 450D John Deere crawlers were notorious for poor starting .We owned Deere's for years before that so we had a good idea it was a recently inherited problem when they wouldn't start nice .The big problem was typically it took John Deere five years to figure out that there was a problem .So you sure never bought the first of the new model upgrade I bought several used units then and the previous owners would mention they would trade the new crawler for the old one back .It was well known that the E in 450E was for Excuses Deere didn't make these for long for a good reason although the engine was a great starter if you got the right one .Digitup.