JD450 Identification not lining up with other posted info...

[kraigthomas]

Well I've been talking with the JD industrial guy here locally and in trying to communicate to him what I have I gave him info off an ID/VIN plate that was on the dash. Rather than calling me nuts he stopped by to get the serial number himself. In the process he said he doesn't think my JD450 was even made in the states. Can anyone help me get the info I need to order the right parts in the future?

The plate on the backside of the battery box near the floor shows: 450 AA 082823L (the lowest number shown in the thread the identifies crawlers was 1965 #10001-16159)

I'm also wondering what year the engine might be since they can be swapped out. The ID plate between the oil filter & two fuel filters shows: 219DT 02 95143T

Thanks. I'll try to attach the ID plate for the crawler.


Here is a link to a picture of the whole loader if that helps: http://www.thomastribune.com/jd450/jd450.jpg
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[digitup2]

There really is one place that 450s were made.We have came across some of these before they look odball but have the same internal parts your serial number is not on the plate on the battery box front this unit may have a location around the kick plate under the seat is the only other real place to find one so it should be right .Now as for the number on the motor that is an engine serial number for years Deere could retro the engine serial number to a frame serial number but I am not shure if they use that any more .Look to see if you have a different injector pump as this unit may have been ment for oversees market .Very few of those units were made with the seat further to the back and fuel tank to the left .We had two in my neck of the woods but they are hard to find !One had a seat handy to get to on the backhoe becouse he didn't have to crawl over the fuel tank like the usual configuration .I at first thought that was why Deere did this but remember the 450s were the first John Deere's to actualy put a fuel tank behind the operator . Digitup.

[kraigthomas]

My fuel tank is on the left & not behind the seat...so does that mean I have one of the weird ones that was destine to be sent oversees but obviously never made it?

I don't understand what you were saying about the engine serial number.

I'm taking the floor plates out this weekend so I'll look for yet another place that has a serial number to help confirm what year this thing is.

Thanks

[digitup2]

If you can find an other serial number than the one you have but I suspect it is right .Don't see this crawler as oddball rather see it as unusuall there aren't many like this but like I said I knew of only two in my area one a 450 crawler loader it had a backhoe on it and the other a 450 dozer didn't stay long as he moved up to a newer machine .It was a real odd one the 450 dozer with that rear station configuration .They weren't as nice to get onto and run as a crawler loader and had no protection from the brush behind you as a small dozer .But as a crawler loader/backhoe the one was more comfortable to run when you were on it .This 450 crawler loader unit was a 1967 model[so they weren't only made the first year of production] the previous owner told me he will look for photos of his it went into eastern Canada when he sold it .They aren't dinasours but not many of these were made what you have is a rare find indeed The chap that owned the crawler hoe told me Deere made these so the older hoe would fit nice on them? .This brings up two questions 1, Is your crawler loader equiped with a hoe hookup and larger pump ? 2 , Lavoy Were the older add on backhoes any different in the seat mounting department than the newer ones for the 350-450 series ? this may have been why Deere did this .It is hard to question John Deere's reasoning of 40 years ago when so few were made .Digitup.

[jupiter]

I have a jd 450a and it is the same as the you have. It´s about 1974-85. i have operator´s manual, parts manual, service and technical manual.

[Lavoy]

I have heard different stories on this configuration. The most common one I have heard is that they were either export crawlers, or were made at the European plant, and imported back here for some reason. If you see literature for the European 450's, they actually have an "A" series designation, whereas we don't. Some people will call a straight 350 or 450 and "A", but it really does not have the designation like a B, or C, etc. The double A in your serial number seems to jive with an export or European built crawler. I bid on some literature in Europe a while back that had a 450A manual, but didn't get it unfortunately.
Years ago when I was with Deere, we took a bus load of customers on a tour of the plants in Iowa and Illinois. While we were at the Waterloo plant, we saw a bunch of new 6000 and 7000 series row crops that were really dorky looking. They had different lower 3PT arms, different fenders, lights, headlights and some other stuff that was weird compared to what you see here. They told us that these were all export tractors built for the European market. None of the features we saw on those tractors could be ordered on a US tractor, they were export only.
As to the backhoes, 50 series up through the 9000 series all mount the same as far as I know.
Lavoy

[digitup2]

I was wondering if the seat mount was a bit shorter to fit lower to the machine and closer to the hoe frame .It would be interesting to see what he has for a injector pump on that 450 should look into that .As for options for other regions I have noticed that we get cold weather start options that the boys down south don't get or even need . I noticed Deere has a Diesel fired motor oil heater and prestart pressure system option for the new J series machines special order in Canada only .Where I am in Ontario is considerably south of the 49 th parralel than you are Lavoy you could use it before me this winter .That option is $3200 Canadian I wouldn't just run out and buy it on my next 550 J word is they are lurking in the wings Digitup.

[kraigthomas]

I'll try to post to all three follow-ups at once, hope I don't miss anything.

I don't know if the seat is lower, but I'm only 5'8" and I sit with my knees bent a bit. Then again it is quite a stretch to the clutch & brake pedal. The seat rotates completely around and gives just enough room to work the backhoe controls.

It is kind of funny because one ID plate says made in France, another says made in Germany. It is quite confused. Anyhow here is a med. sized picture of the crawler.
http://www.thomastribune.com/jd450/jd450.jpg

As to the injector pump, I have no clue...but if you tell me what to look for I can try to figure it out. OR If your in the know, here is a link to a picture of the injector pump. I posted a question about it slightly leaking.
http://www.thomastribune.com/jd450/jd450_fuel_leak.jpg

The backhoe that came on it was a JD75 if I remember right. It is the one that is on a "slide" that can make the center of the backhoe move from side to side.

Hope I got everything mentioned in previous threads.

[Lavoy]

Actually, the origisn on the serial number plates are not all the odd. The Mannheim tractor plant is in Germany, and there is an engine plant in Saran, France.
Lavoy

[clarence]

Kraig, Sorry about the late reply--I just signed on with jdcrawlers. I was hunting around to answer the same question about where my crawler was made and I found you guys. I have a 450 crawler much like yours--tank on the left; 4n1 bucket; larger injector; made in France and Germany serial numbers in the same location as yours.

Looking at your pictures, I believe our bucket is exactly the same as well--Dime to a dollar it is Rubery Owen made in England--Rubery Owen is out of business. I tried to contact them for hydraulic cylinder parts--had to have them custom made. I have the same spin around seat too. The one difference is my rig is a peddle stear. I'm willing to provide you all pictures if you're interested.

The serial number on the dash which says made in France is E7450-003060CD. The serial number on the back side of the hydraulic/battery box says made in Germany and the serial number is 450AA-174508L. If anybody knows what these numbers mean--I'd sure appreciate knowing about them.

My rig does not have a turbo so I suspect it also has dry steering brakes. That said--how do I distinguish from wet or dry steering brakes? I sure wouldn't want to add hydro fluid to dry clutches, obviously. Are there some tell tale signs? I have a parts manual and tech manual for a 450C which only shows wet clutches.

Gentlemen, thank you so much for the informative and useful site/blog--the wealth of your colletive knowledge is humbling--thanks again,

Clarence

[jdemaris]

The serial number on the dash which says made in France is E7450-003060CD. The serial number on the back side of the hydraulic/battery box says made in Germany and the serial number is 450AA-174508L. If anybody knows what these numbers mean--I'd sure appreciate knowing about them.

I've come across many of these foreign market 450s over the years and many still pop up for sale. So, somebody has been shipping them over here.

I inquired about one recently that the owner says has dry steering clutches and the ID numbers are: Made in France E74500117CO and on the battery box - Made in Germany 45CAA069429L. I'm curious what engine it has since the 29L on the end of the German number sounds like it might be 2.9 liter? If so, it's a 179 three-cylinder like Saran built for some 350s. And, maybe it has nothing to do with the engine.

[jdemaris]

As to the injector pump, I have no clue...but if you tell me what to look for I can try to figure it out. OR If your in the know, here is a link to a picture of the injector pump.

That is a CAV pump and is used on German and French engines. Another person on these forums has a 450 in Sweden and it has a Robert Bosch pump instead. USA versions built during the 1960s use Stanadyne/Roosamaster pumps only.

[Jeroen]

The serial number on the dash which says made in France is E7450-003060CD. The serial number on the back side of the hydraulic/battery box says made in Germany and the serial number is 450AA-174508L. If anybody knows what these numbers mean--I'd sure appreciate knowing about them.

I've come across many of these foreign market 450s over the years and many still pop up for sale. So, somebody has been shipping them over here.

I inquired about one recently that the owner says has dry steering clutches and the ID numbers are: Made in France E74500117CO and on the battery box - Made in Germany 45CAA069429L. I'm curious what engine it has since the 29L on the end of the German number sounds like it might be 2.9 litre? If so, it's a 179 three-cylinder like Saran built for some 350s. And, maybe it has nothing to do with the engine.

.I don't think the 2.9 ltr story is right, I've got a 450 AC with the serial number 193731 L I don't think it has been upgraded to a 3.1 ltr engine... Just a different number in the end. I do like to know more....Just recently bought it and really want to know what model it is and from which year.
Sent a question to JD in Germany but don't have an answer yet, since on the ID plate it says that it has been build in Mannheim (Germany)
I'm Dutch living in France ( www.solane.info and www.fargassa.com )

[430deere]

I have just stumbled upon some info regarding 350 & 450 dozers that were built in Canada at he Welland works from 1965-69. There is a picture of one posted on the 350 info page. These models were made a more than one John Deere factory. A "T" designation at the end of the serial number would designate that it was manufactured at the Dubuque Works. A "W" designates the Welland Works. An "L" is used for the Mannheim Works (formerly the Lanz works, hence the "L") I am not sure whether Saran, France ever made these, but I do know that any engines built there will have the engine letter designation "CD" Hope this helps to answer the question "Where was my 350 or 450 made, and why doesn't it fit into the serial numbers listed on this website?"