Arrrggg...Help me out here!

[Al Swearengen]

New rails and sprockets on my 2000 JD 450G...while pushing snow, it appears that the snow/ice buids up between the sprocket and the bushing and POP! I guess it's hopping the sprocket!

95% of the time it is only going downhill, always low gear crawl.

Should I run the rails more loose?

This seriously is not fun to experience.

Works dandy in dry conditions.

[gerald]

Al swerengen. Something else is going on cant figure that out, The track would have to be real loose to jump the sprocket.

[Lavoy]

Actually it is probably building up between the sprocket tip and the pad. It will be much worse when at warmer temps, better at colder temps. Unless you want to cut relief holes in your pads, you are kind of stuck. Every now and then, get on hard ground and run in high gear back and forth, that will tend to rattle some of the snow out.
Lavoy

[Al Swearengen]

Actually it is probably building up between the sprocket tip and the pad. It will be much worse when at warmer temps, better at colder temps. Unless you want to cut relief holes in your pads, you are kind of stuck. Every now and then, get on hard ground and run in high gear back and forth, that will tend to rattle some of the snow out.
Lavoy

Between the tip and the pad....hmmm...good insight Lavoy! Problem is, there is NO hard ground when plowing.

Should I run loose so as not to over stress the finals when this happens?

It's boneshaking bad when it happens. Almost makes me cry!

[Al Swearengen]

Sheesh...another storm coming...until I can remove and cut the pads, do I run loose, loose, loose to lessen the impact on the finals?

I never saw this one coming or I would have cut the pads when I was changing the rails and sprockets!

[mini kahuna]

Lavoy's got it,snow will pack and squeeze to the point it will break something or stop the machine.
whats worse is shutting down the machine with wet snow packed in there and coming back the next morning....froze solid,not good.

running loose is the only way around this,or snow tracks,I never cut a notch out of the pad as Lavoy says,but that would work too.

[Al Swearengen]

Lavoy's got it,snow will pack and squeeze to the point it will break something or stop the machine.
whats worse is shutting down the machine with wet snow packed in there and coming back the next morning....froze solid,not good.

running loose is the only way around this,or snow tracks,I never cut a notch out of the pad as Lavoy says,but that would work too.

Thanks MK...you and Lavoy hepled a great deal and I sure appreciate it. Loose, loose, loose it is until I can do something about it.

Man...again, never saw this one coming!

[mini kahuna]

loose tracks will also pack with snow,be really careful about popping off a track,a snow shoe setup is the real fix,or Lavoy's "relief" notch!

[Al Swearengen]

loose tracks will also pack with snow,be really careful about popping off a track,a snow shoe setup is the real fix,or Lavoy's "relief" notch!

Agreed. I just need to get this snow plowed without overstressing the finals in the process.

[Lavoy]

Yes, I would run a little less tension. Once you have a spot plowed down to hard ground, get on to it and run back and forth in high gear once in a while, about the only thing you can do in the interim.
Lavoy

[digitup2]

I take it you got pillared chains and standard grouser pads and no roller rock guards on a G series and or newer Dozer .When the snow is just the right temp it can be a pain in the A$$ .The nice thing is you can't kill that 450G drive train but the sprockets will complain like crazy. How old are the chains? and how old are the sprockets?.Even the shorter center rock guards aren't great in pack snow When it bangs like that it should be giving on the idler tension spring so little will happen to that G series dozer as they are the toughest drive train to date You probably don't have roller rock guards either and that combination is rough in snow as the rollers can pack snow in as it falls into them then there is no place for a sprocket to shove its tooth into in forward so the sprocket just rides up. You can damage an older sprocket doing that so watch it The newer dozers are not made for all weather conditions and some U/C combination's are the proof cutting holes isn't a real fix either if there are no rock guards or even short guards on the tracks .Digitup.

[Al Swearengen]

I take it you got pillared chains and standard grouser pads and no roller rock guards on a G series and or newer Dozer .When the snow is just the right temp it can be a pain in the A$$ .The nice thing is you can't kill that 450G drive train but the sprockets will complain like crazy. How old are the chains? and how old are the sprockets?.Even the shorter center rock guards aren't great in pack snow When it bangs like that it should be giving on the idler tension spring so little will happen to that G series dozer as they are the toughest drive train to date You probably don't have roller rock guards either and that combination is rough in snow as the rollers can pack snow in as it falls into them then there is no place for a sprocket to shove its tooth into in forward so the sprocket just rides up. You can damage an older sprocket doing that so watch it The newer dozers are not made for all weather conditions and some U/C combination's are the proof cutting holes isn't a real fix either if there are no rock guards or even short guards on the tracks .Digitup.

Thanks Digitup. I do have guards in place...the rails and sprockets only have 40 hours on them; just changed them late summer.

Your thoughts on the drive train are certainly reassuring as the noise made is ALL BUT reassuring when it happens!

I'm still trying to figure out the temparature varient application as last month when I pushed snow, all went well...no popping at all...so you guys sure are on to something with temp. changes.

Now I just have to figure it all out...awesome help, fellas. You guys rock.

[digitup2]

Figure what you got for rock guards there are Three different guard configurations for a G series dozer they are small guard sets front and back then small guard sets mid way about 18 inches long and then full length guards front to back Deere also made Gs with out guards all together .You will find these will go right up through the H and J series as well add that to the computer controlled motor and transmission on those later models and you have a dozer that can take on an attitude complex at any time I order new dozers with full rock guard but we still have problems when things warm up on a cold day Do you keep your dozer inside that is sometimes the worst thing you can do as well a warm Dozer in cold snow is a disaster .It's like a warm combine in a field of frozen corn you can bet at some point you are just going to bung up tighter than the hubs of hell .Only with a combine you can pick your header up and drive home to the warmth and thaw out .With a new style dozer you have frozen piece of yellow crap that goes no where but sits and whines a lot!!been there done that and got the scars to prove it .Digitup.

[Al Swearengen]

loose tracks will also pack with snow,be really careful about popping off a track,a snow shoe setup is the real fix,or Lavoy's "relief" notch!

So, with snow around the corner again, and no relief notches cut, my idea is to make "skirts" for the outside bottoms of the track area to prevent the snow from falling in on the bottoms of the pads.

Ya' think it'll work?

[roadbuilder]

Hi Al,
If you already have full rock guards, relief holes would help as the others have said. They work well on excavators and fellerbuchers. If your homeade skirts are heavy duty enough they might work. I think they should be added to both sides of the track frame as rock guards are. I wonder though, if anyplace that snow or mud collects, then if not removed, freezes, it could cause some damage due to expansion? Would the skirts cause more to collect? I don't do much dozer work in snow around here, so I'm throwing this out more as an observation of how chains fill with other loose types of material. I realize you probably already know this, but it is just intended as food for thought. I apply it to any tracked machine and am assuming it will apply in some extent to snow as well. Cold weather guys correct me if I'm wrong.

Once when I was first learning to run dozer, I locked up a track and spun a 180 on the skid road. My Uncle then walked over to me and said not to do that as it was a bad habit and doing that wasn't good for sub grades or the machine either. He told me to turn around in increments, alittle forward, slight turn, reverse, slight turn and so on. He didn't go into details but I took him at his word. Over the years I began to see how the machine part of the technique worked.

Full rock guards and correct track tension help alleviate this, but it still happens a bit when tracks get really loose.

Hard turns or skid turns allow loose or turned up material to slide over the top of the pads. (it does this on the inside as well, usually opposing end or corners depending on direction of the turn and travel). The longer and tighter the turn, the more and further the material is "pushed", filling the chains. You know what happens next. First time I heard that popping, my stomach turned. I was thinking gears, but when I got off the machine (400hp,D-8L) ("elevated sprockets are immune to dirt build up" is a myth), I found chips off the corners of a couple sprocket teeth and the rails were packed with mineral soil. Like Lavoy says, forward and backward are how you clean them. Depending on how bad they are packed, you might want to start slower, then speed up. Mud, and I assume various stages of snow can squeeze up from between pads, (not forgetting sloughing from the cut bank or over the push arms), so being aware of what you add by turning, might help a bit in limiting the amount of build up. I not saying don't ever lock a track, but limit the length of travel with it locked.

Being aware of what your tracks are doing to the surface also helps keep the boss from having a rigging fit when he sees the furrows or windrows left behind by someone who turned hard on a finished surface.

Happy plowing!