Location of drains for fluids

Jeff Nichols · Post by **Jeff Nichols** » Sun Nov 06, 2011 11:02 am

I have a 350C mid 70's model. I have water in the system for the rearward dipstick. I need to drain it and would also like to drain the other system farther forward. I know one of these is the reverser, and the other is the clutch, trans, and final drives I believe. Also any other locations of fluids I should be monitoring would be helpful
Any help would be appreciated.

CatD8RII · Post by **CatD8RII** » Sun Nov 06, 2011 11:31 am

Hello and welcome to the forums.

Firstly, as long as you are sure you have a 350-C model machine you have 5 drain plugs for the transmission/steering clutch and final drive oil. Its all a common reservior but to get all of it you should remove all of the plugs. There is 1 plug on the bottom rear of the transmission case. There is 1 plug at the bottom of each steering clutch housing and there is 1 plug on the inside bottom of each final drive. The reverser has its own reservior and should not mix oil with the transmission if everything is OK.

The rear most dipstick (behind your left heel) will monitor the trans/steering clutch/final drive oil. The other dipstick thats more forward is for the reverser oil level.

Jeff Nichols · Post by **Jeff Nichols** » Sun Nov 06, 2011 12:18 pm

I got it from the original owner who said it was a C with the wet clutches, Also the markings are still on it and in excellent shape. He's lookin for the manuals for me, and he's also pretty knowledgeable on the machine, but it's been awhile, and he's gettin foggy.
The rearward one, under your left heel has the water in it. The one on the right is losing oil and I believe the pump for that is in front of my left toes, the oil is puddling up along the left side of the motor, and I think one of the lines is rusted out.
I suppose the belly pan needs to come off todrain all these? I found a pretty good answer on the fill procedure on here.

http://www.jdcrawlers.com/messageboard/ ... d+location

Your help is GREATLY appreciated

CatD8RII · Post by **CatD8RII** » Sun Nov 06, 2011 4:27 pm

Sooner or later we're gonna start a FAQ on how to ID a C 350 from the rest (gotta get the broom out of you know where

). For now, the easiest way to tell is to look under the seat (remove the cushion) and see what your steering clutch lever links are hooked to, on a C, they go to 2 spool valves that control the oil flow to the clutch pistons. The pump for the reverser oil is in the front of the reverser, its driven off the reverser's input shaft. I believe the plugs should be accesible with everything still on the machine. I know the final drive plugs are reachable, and I think the steering clutch ones are too. On a machine thats a loader, there is a hole drilled in the bottom counterweight to allow you to get to the transmission plug, and 2 slots to get to the steering clutch plugs. On the dozer I'm pretty sure there are holes in the belly pan to reach them.

Jeff Nichols · Post by **Jeff Nichols** » Sun Nov 06, 2011 11:31 pm

It's a wide track dozer with a winch on the back. I will look under the seat tomorrow. I still need to fix the leak that looks like it's coming from the line next to the block, from a pump that is at the left rear of the motor.

Jeff Nichols · Post by **Jeff Nichols** » Thu Nov 10, 2011 9:18 am

Upon further investigation, there was no pump there. It was where the cooling lines for the reverser come through the bulkhead. Fixed the leaky cooling line, so that solved the problem there.

Yes the control levers go to hyd. valves under the seat, so it's a "real" C model.
I have not changed the fluid in the transmission yet. I'm hoping the water in the system is what is causing the slippage in the drive system.

Any thoughts on this? I hate to put 10 plus gallons of new oil in it if it's not going to help.

KenP · Post by **KenP** » Thu Nov 10, 2011 3:25 pm

deleted

LeonardL · Post by **LeonardL** » Thu Nov 10, 2011 5:38 pm

I agree with Ken, you need to get this water out of the machine. The longer it stays in the system the bigger problems you will have.
If your machine is slipping, I suspect that it is your reverser sense you said you found a cooler line leaking. Leaking cooler line equals low oil level in the reverser. Low oil level equals slipping and other issues. Water in the transmission, clutch housings and final drives will have nothing to do with it slipping. Your steering clutches use engagement pressure from your reverser. So... your slippage could be the reverser or a combination of steering clutches and the reverser.
If you have water in the transmission then chances are you will find it in the reverser as well. This is not a good thing! Before you do anything else you need to change the oil in these systems before you have worse problems. Even as expensive as oil is, it's still cheaper than overhauling these components in your machine.

Jeff Nichols · Post by **Jeff Nichols** » Thu Nov 10, 2011 7:38 pm

I changed the oil in the reverser. And the trans and final drives too, along with the spin on filter under the seat that appears to be for the trans. All fluids are clean now, but I still get slippage in 3rd and 4th. Some times you can feel it lock in, but usually not. If you are moving in 3rd and try to steer, it starts slipping and comes to a stop.

So the consensus is the reverser? It ended up a little overfull, but it's easy to drain a little out. The level snuck up fast. Any chance that could be the problem? BTW it seems ok in 1st and 2nd. But doesn't want to push very hard.

LeonardL · Post by **LeonardL** » Fri Nov 11, 2011 8:19 am

Did you change the filter in the reverser when you changed the oil? If it is clogged or stopped up, it will cause this issue.
Over filling the reverser won't effect the way it should operate. Usually it will push the fluid back out through the vent that's built in to the dip stick. Only messy!
I don't want to over look the simple and obvious so lets see what we can find.
I've ran into this several times and the problem ended up only being something simple. Like debris that had built up between the frame and the valve body for the reverser.
The debris was getting in between the reverser clutch control lever and its stop for the full on position. A little stick or twig had gotten in between the lever and the stop and wasn't engaging the reverser fully. Essentially it was like slipping the clutch.
Another problem I encountered was a little rock or stone that had gotten stuck in a drilled hole in the frame causing the same thing. It wouldn't allow the reverser clutch lever to engage all the way.
Check the clutch pedal and linkage to make sure it isn't binding or has debris built up around it. I've had these clutch pedals get bound up from rust at the shaft where it pivots. Again causing the reverser to not engage all the way. The pedal should work freely.
Also look for debris that may be hindering your steering levers from allowing the steering clutches to engage properly. Usually this causes the machine to steer on its own or pull to one side or the other.
Your reverser valve body is located under the floor board directly under your left foot. There are two plates and you'll need to remove both of them.
For you guys that push a lot of snow. I have had snow pack in and do this same thing.
If these simple things aren't your problem then you will need to have your engagement pressures checked to see what is going on in your reverser.
Hope this helps and good luck... >>>

Jeff Nichols · Post by **Jeff Nichols** » Fri Nov 11, 2011 8:32 am

The only filter I found was under the seat, and it looks like it's for the trans. I changed it too. Where is the one for the reverser? I have the floors pulled out, so I will check for other obstructions in the linkages. It goes straight just fine, and turns fine as well, except in the higher gears.

LeonardL · Post by **LeonardL** » Fri Nov 11, 2011 9:09 am

I'm not sure what the filter is under your seat. Perhaps for the winch? Or maybe something I have forgotten about but it's not for the transmission. The transmission and final drives aren't filtered. There is no pump or anything pressurized in that system. Except for the clutch packs and the reverser supplies the engagement pressure for those. That pressurized oil is then returned back to the reverser.
Unfortunately the reverser filter is inside the reverser. So... That means you will have to drain the reverser oil again to get to it.
There is a plate mounted on the right side, bottom center of your reverser. Right hand as you are sitting in the seat. It is held in place by four bolts and is lightly spring loaded as you remove it. I usually remove three of the bolts and then slowly remove the fourth. If the gasket is stuck, I loosen all four of the bolts and then pry the plate loose until it is against the bolts again. Then take the three out and slowly remove the fourth. The filter will be attached to the plate and will come out as you remove the plate. The spring will be between the filter and the plate and you will see it when you remove it from the reverser.
I hope for you that this is something simple and not a deeper problem. Good luck!

Jeff Nichols · Post by **Jeff Nichols** » Fri Nov 11, 2011 9:21 am

It could be for the winch, that's right behind it. It had hydraulic oil in it. I will order in a filter for the reverser and try that as well as checking for obstructions on the linkages.
I hope it's something simple as well. It supposedly worked fine before they broke the splines in the axle of the wide track extension.
I bought it as is, and repaired all that.
While it was broken there was a flood that had ben about 3 feet deep. The motor got no water in it, but the reverser and tranny did.
It's only been running for a week, so it just sat in the bottom until I ran it. All the fluid looks pretty clear now. It was milky looking after I ran it the first time and circulated everything, I changed it all yesterday.
Should it normally move and steer in all 4 gears without problems? I mean like coming to a stop when you try to steer?

LeonardL · Post by **LeonardL** » Fri Nov 11, 2011 9:36 am

Yes it should. Although in forth gear that is usually a wild ride. But you should not have any slippage in any gear. Forward or reverse. Have you tried it in reverse to see if you still have a slipping issue?

Jeff Nichols · Post by **Jeff Nichols** » Fri Nov 11, 2011 9:57 am

Yep, it's about the same both directions. It wants to roll easier in whatever direction you were already traveling, but it's almost identical really. It reminds me of a clutch slipping on a car to be honest, but it works just fine in 1st and 2nd until you try to push something. It comes to a stop and just seems like it should push harder. Sometimes it will only move one way in 3rd, like I said, the way it was already going. If you hit the throttle, it almost seems like it tries less. I hope it's a clogged filter or obstruction in the clutch linkage. Is there any adjustment for the clutch apply pressure or ?

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Location of drains for fluids

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