450C cracked trans. case. Advice on S/N and parts.

[quisman]

Hello all.
I've been cruising this site for years researching my 450C crawler. I tell ya I would be sunk if it wasn't for this forum.

It's been a couple years since I discovered my 450C has a cracked transmission case. I'm finally getting some money and time saved up to dig into the job. My concern is that i'm not finding some of the parts in my parts book. It would make me feel a lot better if I knew the part I really needed to make to my existing steering houses and any other parts I may need.

Model # is 450CC and my S/N is 347905T
From what I remember it is a 1978

Sitting on top of the transmission top cover is T40240, T43587, and T43568. One of them of course is the top cover to the trans, but the others do not even show up in my parts manual. I want to begin a search for a transmission case or complete transmission but naturally I want the right one....if there is more than one.

Another one is T41462 This looks to be the steering housing but again my parts book does not match so i'm just a little nervous.

Perhaps it's my Parts Catalog. It is PC-1420 and it's date is March 6 of 1981

Right off I noticed one of my sprokets says JD450H and has a completely different part number too.

Any help with the serial #'s or some good places to get some parts would be great.
The motor is mint but she could use a lot of under carriage parts as well. But mostly i'm on a quest for the transmission. Machine still steers right now until it warms up and naturally i'm loosing fluid.

I know this is a job and a half but i'm comfortable.
In the end it's nuts, bolts, housings, seals, etc. It's all about taking your time and doing it right the first time. That and having my backhoe to lift the heavy stuff lol.

Thanks for the help.

[Willyr]

My suspicion is where it is a used tractor, others found parts that would work on the tractor. Heck on my 60 I am finding all sorts of stuff that does not belong (like a sticker that says the clutch pedal should have no more than .375" of play. My clutch is by hand, no pedal).

Also numbers get superseded. So the book you have, may have new numbers than what the tractor has. I presume your parts book is the same thing we see online from the John Deere website.

[quisman]

Thanks willyr !

I figured that was probably the case but needed to hear it I suppose.
Do you know of any resource I can look these part numbers up or is best to hit my deere dealer?

thanks again

[Willyr]

The digital parts list online (free) is

http://jdpc.deere.com/jdpc/servlet/com. ... 1838874197

[JWB Contracting]

Just wondering how many hours you think this task is going to take.

I wrecked the last one that had a cracked case as a case was $2K and I figured a weeks hard labour to swap it out if things went well.

[quisman]

So, I found a JD450 w/ a blown motor online. It is the 3speed trans whereas mine is the 4speed hi lo. I'm unsure of the straight 450 S/N but i'm wondering if anyone knows if my turbo motor from my 450C will bolt in place of the straight 450's blown motor.

Secondly, i'm guessing the transmission cases are different based on gear selection?

Thanks in advance.

[quisman]

Just wondering how many hours you think this task is going to take.

I wrecked the last one that had a cracked case as a case was $2K and I figured a weeks hard labour to swap it out if things went well.

Hi Jason, i'm sorry I totally missed you post.
I'm trying to gauge that myself. As a weekend warrior i'm trying to figure out time. Based on my weekends i was just going to start at the top and work my way down. Pull the rops, pull the top sides(battery box/hydraulic box) and then work on the drive-line and pull the trans out that way.

I was safely factoring about 2 months of weekends between taking care of my kids, stuff around the house, and getting parts I was unsure if I needed or not.

I'll try and track as i'm soon to start the project.

Does anyone know if these transmissions are cast steel ???

[JWB Contracting]

I am thinking it will take about the following

- 15 hours to dissassemble, includes removing engine, loader, removing tracks, fuel tanks, side boxes, final drives and finally the transmission

- 10 hours to fix transmission, once you get in there you will probably find more wrong such as bearings, clutch packs, etc.

- 20 hours to reassemble

This would not include any time to deal with many problems such as broken frame bolts, etc.

Just a rough estimate. It is alot of work, but can be done. Most of the crawlers that I work on are for re-sale so I try and estimate the repair time before starting a re-build.

If I can make back $50 per hour on my labour I either don't buy the fixer uper or wreck the machine instead.

[quisman]

Just sucked up a jd450 straight. Model year appears to be 69. Looks like a lot of similarities. Hopefully the transmission is one of them. Says it's a 4 speed hi lo c mesh. Great bottom end, bad motor.

Anyone happen to know if the transmission housing is cast iron or steel??

[JWB Contracting]

I am fairly certain that the transmission case between a 450 and 450C are different as the 450C will have additional plumbing for the wet steering clutches and different clutch housing mounting. Also, the pressure lines in the case on a 450 are threaded instead of the push together fitting on the 450C.

With that said, we have used components from an older 450 HLR transmission in a C. It can be done, but there will be some machining involved. I believe we installed the complete HLR clutch packs and the transmission pump / front bearing assembly.

I am confused on your earlier post on the 450 being a 3 speed. The only 3 speed deeres i have seen are the 550's.

Your 450C engine will fit in the 450, you may need to swap the flywheel, clutch and pressure plate. I known that a 450 and 450B are different so a 450 and 450C most likely are as well.

If you posted some pictures of the two machines we all could offer you some more assistance.

[quisman]

Jason, thanks so much for the great info.

From what I could see the case part numbers assembled are the same. I did notice the top rear cover was different but it "looked" like the steering housing was a match up as far as mounting. But all this is mearly by looking through the two service manuals back and forth and pictures i've taken of both machines.

I'm trying to get the 450 delivered this weekend so I can get her parked by the 450C so I can start taring into it.

Another question you may have the answer to...will my six way blade bolt in place of that straight setup?
It sure looked like a match except for hydralics and controls (which is the easy part in my opinion)

I figured the motors were a near match since the clutch housing part numbers were the same. I notice the clutches for both are 11 inches so I was too hoping one would work vs the other.
It's going to be quite a project that's for sure.

I'm really hoping to end up with two functional machines when this is done. If I get the machine home this weekend I'll take a bunch o pics !

Here are a couple that I do have now just to show them off !

[quisman]

Hello again everyone. Raising this thread from the dead with hopes of help and giving others information.
I have my newer 450 completely taken down so the transmission is sticking out the back. I gouged the Crack and am supporting it w a bottle jack. I have taken a cold weld approach using a Lincoln sp-115 might with gold gas. Very light quick beads followed by peening for about 10 seconds. So far the project is going well but time is getting to be a factor plus I will need an under carriage.

So fast forward to my bucket 450c. It has been sitting for 2 years. Fired right up the other day and ran great aside from the hole in the radiator. I'm in process of replacing the radiator.

My HUGE question. Does anyone think or know or have input on retrofitting the older bucket dozer with the 6 way blade setup from the newer 450c ???

From what I can see from alignment it will fit but will have to also redo the gauges and maybe the rear axle support mounts.
Anyone have any experience?

Thanks a ton !

I'll throw up some pics soon of the project.

[rock digger]

Weld the case.and move on to other things. I welded mine on a 450b several months ago and it works fine. Check the bolts that go to the finals . If the fram is cracked near these bolts line it up and weld it.

If you buy all those parts and put all the time in to changing the case it is not worth it.

You will be told that you can not weld that case.but I can tell you it can be done I have talked to several who have done it and had good results.

If it does not work now what have you got to lose except your time?

[quisman]

Thanks Rock Digger !

I guess i'm nearly in the middle as far as time goes to question which one may be quicker. I took the radiator and oil cooler out of the 78 and put it onto the older loader crawler today. I didn't get to fire it up, but will finish plumbing the oil lines in the morning and bring her to life.

My biggest problem is i'm kind of stuck between both machines.

The 78 with the 6 way blade has the cracked trans, but the under carriage is also shot. All rollers, tracks, chains, and steering clutches will require replacement as well. So, i'm looking at finishing up the weld job and hope it works(i too am confident if you take your time, the weld will be fine). Then I have to get a loan LOL to put a new under carriage in or disassemble the older bucket crawler and bolt everything up on the 78.

OR

If the radiator fixes the over heating issue on the bucket crawler, then I have a good running, 90% under carriage(not sure of steering yet) machine that is ready to go aside from the need for the 6 way blade. I lose the turbo but I think it's going to save me a ton of time in the end game if the 6 way can bolt up to it.

Then I can part out the other machine to poor souls like myself lol.

Thoughts? again..... Still wondering if anyone knows if the 6 way will "bolt up" to the loader crawler?

[quisman]

Todays fun !





One side of the crack before the gouge and weld began.....