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carson · Post by **carson** » Fri Nov 01, 2013 5:34 pm

Hey folks,

I'm new to the forum and new to crawlers. Been on farm tractors since I was about 5, but just bought my first crawler. A 450 high-lift. She has a Drott bucket and rippers (minus shanks) on the back. Oh, and she doesn't run. Previous owner let her get rained in this past spring. Seems to have a bent rod. She will turn over well, but won't start. An engine rebuild is in order. Should I pull the engine and have it done in a shop. Or, do an inframe rebuild ? Where is the best place to buy engine kits? Any info is appreciated. All comments will be taken as 'positive' contributions. Thanks,
carson

jtrichard · Post by **jtrichard** » Fri Nov 01, 2013 8:00 pm

what makes you say it has a bent rod? if its cranking are you getting fuel to the injectors? any white smoke out the exhaust ? depends on what is wrong and how much you have to spend as to how to rebuild.. was it stuck? and you or the P.O. got it to turn?

carson · Post by **carson** » Sat Nov 02, 2013 12:45 pm

After a new starter,new battery and several days of treating for assumed stuck rings, we finally got a small amount of white smoke out the exaust. Eventually, we acheived one 'robust' crank over ( she actually,kinda skipped once). That session was accompanied by 3, well spaced metallic smacks (sounded like a hammer under the crawler). At that point someone suggested that we didn't want her to start as mucho damage might occur. And thats were I am now. I can pull the engine and take it to a very good shop. Or, I know a mechanic who will come and rebuild the engine in place. Is one choice much better than the other? Remember, this is my first crawler. Also, Levoy (?) do you sell the rebuild kits for the engine?

thanks
carson

scampr · Post by **scampr** » Sat Nov 02, 2013 1:11 pm

Bent rod?? as in connecting rod? Were you about able to check the compression? I would want to do some serious checking before diving into a rebuild?

DukeofDeere · Post by **DukeofDeere** » Sat Nov 02, 2013 2:45 pm

With that much noise I would think about pulling the engine.
Could drop the pan and take a look.
Sounds like major time.

Duke

scampr · Post by **scampr** » Sat Nov 02, 2013 6:37 pm

oops didnt read the part about the noise... agreed drop the pan and check the bearings ,loud hammers are never good.

jtrichard · Post by **jtrichard** » Sat Nov 02, 2013 7:13 pm

yeah pull pan and see what you can from the bottom if nothing jumps out at you then start pulling rod caps and see what you have

Scottyb · Post by **Scottyb** » Sat Nov 02, 2013 7:49 pm

Pull the valve cover off, you might have a stuck valve. As well, I had an engine that the mice got into the exhaust and worked their way into the engine with about 5 lbs of canola seed. Couldnt figure it out until I took the head off. I am not sure what you meant by rained? like down the exhaust pipe?
Scott

jtrichard · Post by **jtrichard** » Sat Nov 02, 2013 7:56 pm

the hammering you heard could be a piston trying to close a valve ...if it got rain down the exhaust very well could have a stuck valve

carson · Post by **carson** » Sat Nov 02, 2013 8:26 pm

Thanks y'all for your input. Guess we'll start with the pan and i'll keep you posted.

carson

Scottyb · Post by **Scottyb** » Sat Nov 02, 2013 9:26 pm

Carson, here is what I think you have. Water in the exhaust went into the head where it found an open exhaust valve and made its way into your cylinder(s) where it rusted until the piston (perhaps more than one) was stuck. A new starter and battery got it loose with help from whatever you used to help it loosen up. Then once it got moving a rusty valve stem is opened by the rocker arm, sticks open and then is closed when the piston comes up and hits it causing a clank. The problem repeats on every cycle and right there you stopped as you should. I would take 5 minutes to remove the cover, turn it over a bit at a time to see if a valve is indeed stuck. If so, stop right there and remove the head, clean up the sides of the cylinder walls with rust remover and perhaps give them a light hone and clean carefully. Then check the head for bent valves, replace if needed, put the head back on and you could be good to go for $0. I would however use a new head gasket.

Heck, I might be way out in left field here but please do not pull the pan until you check this out. More than once I have seen an engine apart when their was an easy fix that I/they overlooked. I saw a engine half apart when it was one bent fan blade hitting on a bracket! It could even be the isolator?? (Might not be one on the 450)
I hope your problems are small and your luck is good!

Scott

DrLoch · Post by **DrLoch** » Sun Nov 03, 2013 6:17 am

Agree with Scottyb.

DukeofDeere · Post by **DukeofDeere** » Sun Nov 03, 2013 10:50 am

It is wise to open er up and see what is wrong.
Remove a valve cover, absolutely.
Drop the pan, makes sense to see if a bent rod or debris in the pan.
Run a machine with rust and junk in the cylinders and score a piston and cylinders is foolish to me!!
Many engine have been run and compromised from rain and other obstructions which could have been removed if opened up properly and dealt with.
The unknowns are numerous.
Knowledge of what is going on is Priceless.

Duke

carson · Post by **carson** » Sun Nov 10, 2013 7:47 pm

thanks to all of you. progress is slow, too many things getting in the way. ill be tearing into it this coming weekend. hope to keep you posted..

carson

DukeofDeere · Post by **DukeofDeere** » Tue Nov 19, 2013 6:41 pm

Hope you are making progress.
Any updates would be appreciated.

Peace,
Duke

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