Fuel injector issues - Finally had to remove the hood

GRWeldon · Post by **GRWeldon** » Mon Dec 30, 2013 7:00 pm

Some of you may remember that when I bought my 350B last month, the diesel engine had a bit of a miss. Until today I have neglected to investigate. I almost ran out of fuel today but shut her down before she just quit, but she sucked some air. I refueled and started her up, but the RPMs were slowly oscillating at high rpm and she just quit at around 1200.

I bleed the filters using the transfer pump lever and restart. Better, but still not right. While doing this I discover a loose connection coming out of the transfer pump. It appears that the strainer has been removed and a short piece of brass tubing inserted in it's place. The elbow attaching to the transfer pump is loose and I can't seem to get the fuel line off the brass tubing to investigate without destroying the fuel line.

Anyway, I put it all back together, bled the filters manually with the pump, started the machine and bled all the lines at the pump AND bled the injectors one by one. After bleeding #3 and #2, the machine was running as good as it was before I ran out of fuel. I should have left well enough alone. When I get to injector #1, (the one that has been leaking) I break the fitting loose, the machine start to miss when fuel squirts out, and I tighten it back up only to find it won't stop leaking and the machine is running poorly and missing worse than ever.

I already have injectors on hand so I guess tomorrow is the day. I started removing them today and got #2 out relatively easily. I started on #1 and it's is a bit more stubborn plus there really is no good place to pry on it while turning it at the same time. Since it is turning, I think I'll be able to get it out OK. I should have seen if I could twist #3 before leaving tonight but I didn't.

I'll need some parts to try to fix the leaks so I'm headed to the JD store in the morning. I hope the parts are available and that I can get the other two injectors out. If anybody has any suggestions on how to best get the injectors free, please comment. I'll check back in the morning for replies. Wish me luck!

jsal · Post by **jsal** » Tue Dec 31, 2013 6:29 am

there are small slide hammers available makes removal super easy.

I totally destroyed a set in my 350 have since purchased a puller and changed injectors on a 302 tractor with no problems check online .

Jim

Post by **Lavoy** » Tue Dec 31, 2013 10:48 am

Might try some sort of penetrant on them the day before just in case it would make any difference.
Lavoy

Farmerford · Post by **Farmerford** » Tue Dec 31, 2013 11:22 am

I thought I must have been doing something wrong when I destroyed an OTC brand slide puller trying (unsuccessfully) to remove the injectors on my 455D a few years ago. Fortunately (?) I gave up for a while and by the time I returned to the project it needed a new head gasket as well. Then I saw a post by J D Maris on here saying that it is not unusual to have to drive the injectors out from the cylinder side of the head. So I took a 5/16" diameter rod and drove them out. A couple of them took many heavy blows; I don't think a puller would have applied enough force before the jaws spread.

GRWeldon · Post by **GRWeldon** » Tue Dec 31, 2013 7:34 pm

Thank you Jsal, Lavoy and Farmerford for your replies. I completed the job today, changing the fuel filters, sealing up and tightening loose fittings, cleaning gunk from the injector pump, transfer pump and fuel filter mount.

I can not believe the GUNK inside the filters! I'm amazed the ole' girl was running at all! It's absolutely disgusting. It looked as if it hadn't been changed in years! Here is a pic:

http://www.forestryforum.com/gallery/al ... 45B15D.jpg

There was one uncooperative sticky injector but with repeated prying back and forth (twisting) and continuous up pressure applied with another bent-screwdriver type prybar, it came out after about 45 minutes. That was #1. #2 came out fairly easy yesterday and #3 came right out by prying straight up on in.

I lost one of the banjo bolt washers that go on either side of the injector lines. It fell down in all the oily, leafy, dirty mess below the injector pump. I pulled out some of the junk and put it on the track looking for the washer. I did this 5 times then gave up. After installing the injectors, I decided to look some more and before I brushed off all the crap on the track, I noticed the washer in the middle of the black mess remaining. Then I proceeded to install one of the fuel lines and promptly dropped the washer again into the black muck that was still remaining under the pump. I gave up again and resigned myself to getting the part from the dealer on Saturday and finishing up then. Then I decided to get ALL of the junk out of there and be done with it. I pulled about 3 quart-sized containers of junk out including the black, oily, fully decomposed sparrow with nothing but skeleton and feathers!

I had all the lines hooked back up (last banjo bolt loose waiting for the washer) and when I looked over the track, what do I see? The washer is laying on the last layer of crap that I took out! I was overjoyed and thanked Jesus!

I installed the washer and line and I left all the injector lines a bit loose. I reconnected the battery and cranked her over. She sputtered, but I could tell the battery was low. When I saw fuel coming from the injector lines, I tightened them all up. I cranked some more and grey smoke was coming from the exhaust, but the batteries weren't supplying enough juice to start the old girl.

Tomorrow between the rain showers I'll take jumper cables back to the farm and jump her off with the Ford Tractor. Hopefully she will fire up and like the fresh, green, on-road diesel that I'm feeding her!

Bummer is that I can't drain the sump in the tank with the backhoe attachment on and I can't take it off without the tractor hydraulics working. When I can get access to the rear of the tank, I'll do some draining there too. Depending on what I find, I may have to change the first fuel filter again, but time will tell.

I'm anxious to see if she runs any better...

Post by **Lavoy** » Wed Jan 01, 2014 12:35 pm

With the way those filters look, I would be the old girl was missing just out of spite!

It still amazes me sometimes how bad things can be and these old crawlers will still run.
Lavoy

Labparamour · Post by **Labparamour** » Sun Jan 12, 2014 11:07 pm

How about cleaning tank from topside with a "suck bucket?"
http://www.heavyequipmentforums.com/sho ... =Suck+tank

Could vacuum around the bottom and not just what drains from the center...

GRWeldon · Post by **GRWeldon** » Mon Jan 13, 2014 7:00 am

Fortunately, that won't be necessary. Some time ago I removed the batteries to charge them. I put them back in on Saturday and the ole' girl started up within 3 seconds of pushing the starter switch button! She ran like a champ. No more miss... smooth as silk. No fuel leaks either. I'm very pleased!

Thanks for all the helpful replies everybody!

GRWeldon · Post by **GRWeldon** » Wed Jan 15, 2014 7:09 am

It would appear that my "miss" has returned, if only slightly. After using the machine last night I noticed the injector pump was leaking. I haven't been able to determine exactly where but I'll do that next time I get a chance.

I have a question... The small copper-looking washers that go on both sides of the fuel line banjo bolts, do they need to be replaced each time the fuel line is removed? I did not replace them when I had the fuel lines off.

Another question... Are there any other places an injector pump can leak besides the fuel line connections? It would seem that the throttle lever/shaft would have a seal of some sort. I tightened up all the fuel line bolts last night and it still leaked and it appears that the drips are coming from the back of the pump which would be where the throttle lever is.

And finally, another question... Would any of the leaks that I've mentioned cause a slightly erratic running of the engine (miss)? It's not as bad as it was before I changed the injectors and the engine has much more power than it did before the injector change (25-30% maybe). The erratic running sounds quite a bit different than it did before and I'm wondering if it could be caused by a worn governor? Just thinking out loud. I really have no clue.

Thanks for reading. Advice/opinions are welcome!
Glen

Labparamour · Post by **Labparamour** » Wed Jan 15, 2014 6:55 pm

Had a couple lines leaking at the injector and just cleaned,loosened and retightened. Then found drip leaking off injector pump at a high pressure injector line- did the same thing…cleaned with kerosene, loosened and retightened. Corrected all leaks. Basically, I'm thinking you can reuse the coppers as long as they seal. I smelled the leaking fuel but never really noticed a difference running- before or after.
Will be watching this post to learn more and keep the ol' girl running.

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Fuel injector issues - Finally had to remove the hood

Fuel injector issues - Finally had to remove the hood

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