450C

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jtrichard
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Post by jtrichard » Mon Dec 01, 2014 11:21 am

We are still NOT sure he has a "C" model ....a lot of us know that people mistake 450c on the ser.# tag as a "C" model and NOT a 450 crawler he has hinted in his second post that he thought the steering boxes were meant to be DRY hence 450 or 450B not a "C"
2010 with 622 dozer with mod. 35 ripper and a 2010 with 622 dozer bought in 1969 and a 2010 loader with drott and mod. 36 ripper

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Stan Disbrow
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Post by Stan Disbrow » Mon Dec 01, 2014 1:31 pm

Hi,

"make sure the bellhousing is full of oil"

I think there is a 'not' missing there.....

As in it should read 'not full of oil'.

Did the 450C have a wet main engine clutch in addition to the steering clutches? Having never had a 450C, maybe I missed something?

But the post goes on to mention a plugged drain hole and possibly seeping seals, so I don't think I am missing anything there...

Stan
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DrLoch
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Post by DrLoch » Mon Dec 01, 2014 2:00 pm

Stan you are correct, should have been a "not" in there. Fingers going faster than the brain some times..... Fixed it.

If it was a wet clutch option, wouldn't that like a lockup torque converter but different? :roll:

Besides jtrichards said, we still aren't really sure its a 450C.
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Scottyb
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Post by Scottyb » Mon Dec 01, 2014 2:13 pm

DrLoch, Thanks for the easy to follow detailed description of clutch adjustment. I am going to do a check on my 450c dozer just to be sure I am on. Recently it was slipping and the engagement was right at the top as I let out the pedal. So I just let out the bolt by the pedal a few turns and all was good. However, I see that I need to go through all the steps to be sure I am not wearing any parts unnecessary. I have the manual and will also read the section over again carefully before starting out.

Thanks again Scott

Dave Buchanan
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Post by Dave Buchanan » Mon Dec 01, 2014 4:14 pm

The 450 & 450B had a plate on the side of the steering clutch to adjust the steering clutches . On the 450c if you take seat out right below the fuel the plate on the top of the transmission covers the ring gear . The cover has two spool valves in it . The linkage from these valves will hook to the steering lever.

Dave Buchanan
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Post by Dave Buchanan » Mon Dec 01, 2014 4:17 pm

I should say right below the fuel tank sorry.

rufustoad
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Post by rufustoad » Sun Dec 07, 2014 5:26 pm

DrLoch and others, thank you so much for your time and great info and I am sure it is a 450-C and I meant to get the SN and forgot but I promise I will!! I am 100% that the main clutch is bad and slipping. I am also 100% that the left brake housing is full of oil and also has a bit of pressure when I pull the adjusting plug. I know there is a feed hose inside the housing and was wondering if there is anything else that could cause that housing to fill with oil and create pressure? Also once I pull the fuel tank, the HLR lever/battery housing then pull the top of the clutch cover can you start the engine to locate the leak and also can you drain the oil from that housing and replace the brake band without removing the final housing, sprocket, and track? God Bless
God Bless
Todd

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jtrichard
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Post by jtrichard » Sun Dec 07, 2014 7:49 pm

why are you replacing the brake band?
2010 with 622 dozer with mod. 35 ripper and a 2010 with 622 dozer bought in 1969 and a 2010 loader with drott and mod. 36 ripper

rufustoad
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Post by rufustoad » Sun Dec 07, 2014 8:12 pm

jtrichard, because that entire cavity is fill of hydrualic fluid and I have no driver side steering. The book is not toyally clear but I am possative the band can not have oil on it.
God Bless
Todd

rufustoad
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Post by rufustoad » Sun Dec 07, 2014 9:16 pm

Again I could be wrong on this but when I pull the plug that gives access to the brake band adjusting nut I have hyd fluid pouring out and the passenger side is dry. As I look at the TM1102 service manual it appears to me that the clutch discs and the drum are on the same saft together but the clutch assy is full of oil and the brake bands are sealed off and dry?? I could be completely wrong on that so if I am please don't hesitate in correcting me :?: Even if I am wrong (please don't tell my wife :lol: ) I am loosing hyd fluid and that cavity has never before had fluid pouring out of it so I am assuming I blew a seal or the pressure line that feeds the clutch pack.
God Bless
Todd

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DrLoch
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Post by DrLoch » Mon Dec 08, 2014 10:42 am

The steering housings are suppose to have oil in them, approx 3 gallons per side. If it's pouring out of the brake adjust plug then you have another issue. Your serial number will give an indication if yours is an early or later model. The later units were converted to a common sump design. Since you have the manual look in Powertrain 40, 15-5. That refers to converting the steering clutch housing to common sump.

If yours is indeed an early unit and perhaps the clutch pack or line is leaking or broke. If the Common sump conversion hasn't been done then the oil would have no way to return to the main sump.

We won't say anything to your wife, all part of the learning curve.. :D
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jtrichard
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Post by jtrichard » Mon Dec 08, 2014 11:29 am

I agree that you have a bad hose OR the clutch pack seal is gone (BAD) ..... sounds like you have the early model if so and you say the RIGHT side is DRY you need to find where you fill it to the proper level ...... the brake bands DO run in fluid ...Read this thread it should help you with what you have http://www.jdcrawlers.com/messageboard/ ... +hose+leak
2010 with 622 dozer with mod. 35 ripper and a 2010 with 622 dozer bought in 1969 and a 2010 loader with drott and mod. 36 ripper

rufustoad
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Post by rufustoad » Mon Dec 08, 2014 12:27 pm

Before I go too far let me first say that you guys are great for helping others with your knowledge!! I have been a technician for a long time and I find this set up to a bit intimidating especially on a piece of equipment that I have so much invested!! Also has anyone noticed that the posted dates are all messed up on this forum? Tonight when I get home I will get my SN and post it so we will know for sure the year but I am almost sure its an 83 model. I also would have never guessed that the brake band would be submersed in fluid and I am sure it is in the manual :oops:, just not the part I have read yet :lol:. Be back soon
God Bless
Todd

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DrLoch
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Post by DrLoch » Mon Dec 08, 2014 1:36 pm

If it's a 83 I would think it's a common sump. That being said you need to get the top off so you can see whats leaking. Hopefully it's just a line....

Just curious, if you haven't run the machine some time if you remove the plug for the brake adjustment is the oil still coming out of the hole?
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rufustoad
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Post by rufustoad » Mon Dec 08, 2014 1:53 pm

Hey Doc, I hope I was not misleading when I said the machine had not been run for a long time!! I did go out at least 2-3 times a year and start it and warm the engine. I should have said "used" it in a long time. Also I think I mentioned this before but the crawler will move when it is cold so Saturday I backed out the rest of the adjustments out on the main clutch and drove it 50-75ft to get it cleaned off and get it ready to pull into my shop. It was cold outside and I noticed steam coming out of the bellhousing and then she stopped pulling again. So when I told you that the fluid was coming coming out of the brake adjustment plug that is something I just noticed within the last few days and what confused me was the pressure that was behind it :shock:
God Bless
Todd

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