early 40c, with 'plumber's special' loader

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JD420c56
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early 40c, with 'plumber's special' loader

Post by JD420c56 » Wed Dec 07, 2005 11:09 pm

To make a long story short, My boss bought a 40c a few nights ago, to replace the 420C I bought from him. It has that odd looking loader made out of pipe, Does deere make this loader or is it after market? Are they any specifications for it, such as lift capacity etc? Your thoughts greatly Appreciated. Thanks! -Mike

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Post by Lavoy » Wed Dec 07, 2005 11:38 pm

I think there are a couple of dfferent ones, Wagner and Horn would be my best guess. Unless you can find some original literature, specs will be hard to find.
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Post by JD420c56 » Wed Dec 21, 2005 11:04 pm

Image

hopefully that works, I took the pic with my cellphone, not too bad. It is a wagner loader. The motor is locked up though. My boss paid $1650 for it, Check out the huge bucket! I can stand on it and the crawler moves some. What do you guys think?

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Post by fishhawk » Thu Dec 22, 2005 8:24 am

i'm surprized they got a bucket for a smaller dozer like that wish i could get one like that for my 440 just for mucking out a small pond.

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Post by Lavoy » Thu Dec 22, 2005 9:23 am

I just noticed that it appears to be a 3 roller crawler. Get the loader off of it as soon as possible. A 3 roller crawler does not handle a blade well, let alone something as heavy as a loader. It outs a great deal of stress on the front idler, but mostly on the forward roller as the front idler is undersize, so the first roller becomes the pivot point. Rollers for this crawler are getting hard to come by and are quite expensive when you find them.
That being said, he did fine as far as price, there were only 2262 3 roller 40's made, so that is a nice find.
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Post by JD420c56 » Thu Dec 22, 2005 10:56 pm

Even though the motor is locked up, it doesnt seem like too bad of a machine, is the loader that bad of an idea? We were gonna take the bucket off and use it to clean the barn with a manure fork. It is a early 53 as well. It wont be worked alot, just a utility type thing. Is the loader worth anything?

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Post by Lavoy » Fri Dec 23, 2005 9:37 am

It is not that it will not function with the loader, it obviously will. Look at it this way, stand beside the crawler a little ways back. Look at the first roller, not the front idler, the roller next to it. Now look how much crawler is ahead of that point, and how much is behind it. Now imagine a really big cast iron teeter-totter with a loader on the front if it. That first roller is the fulcrum. The front idler on a 3 roller crawler is undersize, so it lends no support whatsoever unless the crawler it literally standing on its nose (which this one has spent most of its life doing due to the loader). Add in the weight of the loader, the counterweights, and whatever load is in the bucket tipping the crawler forward, and you have probably double the weight of the crawler being held up by two little cast iron rollers that were meant to hold up 1/5 of a crawler weighing half that much. Sooner or later (if they are not already) you are going to break the forward rollers, and maybe the front idlers. The cost of these parts, if you can even find them, will be most of what he paid for the crawler.
So as I said above, will it work, sure, but the question is should it, and is it worth the risk. If you are willing to potentially damage the crawler, then that's okay, but just be aware of the cost to repair, or at that if you don't fix it, you have a big hunk of broken iron that is now truly a parts crawler.
If he needs a loader that bad, take the loader off of this one, get it running and sell it for what it is, a kind of scarce crawler. Take the money and go buy a later 40 or 420 with a jobber loader that runs and drives and has an undercarraige that will stand the load.
The loader that is on there is of no real value.
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Picture in the upper left corner

Post by steamfitter99 » Fri Dec 23, 2005 6:41 pm

Hello, not that it really matters, there is a picture of this loader on a three roller crawler in the upper left corner. The loader looks the same, but with a much smaller bucket. I am not saying that you should keep the loader on the crawler, but maybe it is more rare with this loader on it. I agree whole heartedly with Lavoy. A 420 with a large bucket can tear up the front rollers and the front idlers. I know this from experience. Tom.

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Post by Lavoy » Fri Dec 23, 2005 9:14 pm

That is a Wagner loader. It is quite light, I would be the bucket on that 40 weighs almost as much as the whole loader on that MC. I have the literature that the pic came from, and that loader on an MC was rated at 700lbs maximum lift. The bucket is about the size of two large shavels. With that loader, operated properly, you would greatly reduce the chances of undercarraige damage. Also, the bucket is quie close to the grille, so that the "lever arm" is not as great. The one of the 40 looks to be several feet out in front, almost like it was meant for 5 roller machine.
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Post by JD420c56 » Sun Dec 25, 2005 12:48 am

Lavoy, would you have a blade for the 40c? The loader might come off, but if not, we would just use a manure fork on it. Are the rollers rebuildable? Thanks

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Post by Lavoy » Sun Dec 25, 2005 12:16 pm

Only blades that really belong on a 3 roller 40 are #1000 tool carrier, or an MC60. I do not have either right now.
Rollers are chelled cast iron, very hard, and very difficult to try and build up. Also, there are no replaceable wear parts on these rollers, when worn out, you replace the roller, the end caps, or both.
I have been working on an alternative roller that could be installed with machining of some original parts, but I have not had time to get very far, and I only have enough parts to do 20 rollers.
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