1010 gas stubborn starter

[Bret4207]

Okay, I'm tired of changing plugs and spending hours getting the stupid 1010 going every spring or any other time I don't use it more than once a month. Strong battery, fresh rebuild with new everything and valve job, running Autolite plugs, not crappy Champions. Once I get it going it's fine as long as I run it every few days and even then I have to change plugs every other time. I have solid core wires too.

Any ideas? I know this stuff pretty good and this is just frustrating. It should run fine.

[Gil]

My best guess would be that you have moisture getting into your distributor.
But don't be too confident in that. My last guess was that the economy was going to rebound this month.

[Stretch]

What do the plugs look like when you pull them out to change? Have you tried a hotter plug?
You could be running rich and need to adjust carb, also just for grins see if you can detect any hint of gas in your oil.
What color is the spark?
Is the coil new?
Just my two cents.

[jdemaris]

Okay, I'm tired of changing plugs and spending hours getting the stupid 1010 going every spring or any other time I don't use it more than once a month. Strong battery, fresh rebuild with new everything and valve job, running Autolite plugs, not crappy Champions. Once I get it going it's fine as long as I run it every few days and even then I have to change plugs every other time. I have solid core wires too.

Any ideas? I know this stuff pretty good and this is just frustrating. It should run fine.

1010 gas engines were known for that cold starting problem, especially with aftermarket ignition coils. I am assuming it's due to the combustion chamber design that requires a very high voltage spark. And yes, I know that voltage will only rise to what is required to jump a spark-plug gap.

When 1010s were new, they came with three different coils, depending on - if the tractor had the Wico, Prestolite, or Delco system. All the coils were 6 volt and even when the resistor was in use, still ran 810 volts all the time. 8-10 volts on a 6 volt coil results in short life of ignition points - which 1010s were also known for - especially the Prestolite systems. Again, when new - the 1010s had a small ignition resistor built into the ignition switch and the resistor was heat-sensitive - kind of like what many Ford tractors use. Then Deere came out with an upgrade kit to install a separate porcelain resistor and it eliminated the one built into the switch. The Deere kit came with a wire harness, new key switch, and a new porcelain resistor.

If you have a Delco starter (not Prestolite) - just do this. Make sure you've got a Deere 2 cylinder tractor 6 volt coil - or an exact equivalent. Do NOT use a generic 12 volt system coil. Then, make sure you run a wire from the small "R" terminal on your Delco starter solenoid - to the power side of your coil primary connection. I don't know if you're running positive or negative ground. Just run the wire to the small post that is NOT hooked to the points. This will send full system voltage to the coil when ever the starter is cranking. Deere did not do it simply because not all 1010s had Delco starters, and the Prestolite starters do not have the built-in bypass provision.

If you DO have a Prestolite starter, then you really need the correct Deere 1010 ignition switch that has a built in resistor bypass.

[Bret4207]

Thanks J, I have a standard 12 volt coil and a Delco unit I think. I'll check the rest out. Makes sense.

[Bret4207]

Put a new 6 volt JD coil in the 1010 and made sure it was wired right (I'm positive ground). The old girl took right off like a rocket!!! Thanks "J"!!!! Of course the tracks are still worn out, but at least I can move her around and use the hoe.

[gus]

Bret, if none of that works, paint it green and put 420 decals on it. 420's always start.....

[Forgefire4570]

I have a gas 1010 that was about the same as you described. Mine always started hard and ran crappy. The best thing I ever did was install a 12 volt electronic ignition kit. It cost me about $100, but has saved me hours of cussing and swearing. Its any easy installation and doesn't affect the "look" if any correct police are reading this. Besides the electronic ignition, I also installed a one wire alternator and rewired the whole tractor. Like I said, its the best money I've spent on it so far! I bought mine through the Yesterday's Tractor parts site. Hope this helps.

[jdemaris]

I have a gas 1010 that was about the same as you described. Mine always started hard and ran crappy. The best thing I ever did was install a 12 volt electronic ignition kit. It cost me about $100, but has saved me hours of cussing and swearing. Its any easy installation and doesn't affect the "look" if any correct police are reading this. Besides the electronic ignition, I also installed a one wire alternator and rewired the whole tractor. Like I said, its the best money I've spent on it so far! I bought mine through the Yesterday's Tractor parts site. Hope this helps.

Nothing wrong with electronic breakerless, but there's nothing wrong with the original setup either. When fixed and set up correctly, 1010s start fine.
The difference as I see it is this. If any part fails in your electronic setup, you're not going to find any parts locally or quickly to fix it. With the original setup, you can always find something to make it work. And, 20 years from now? May not be anything available anywhere for the Petronix setup. Time will tell. I've seen many breakerless kits and companies, come and go, over the years.

[townlineterry]

Gotta second Forgefire on this, had the same problem with my 1010, Petronix solved the problem. Also have a 1959 Lull forklift that is a hard starter, again the Petronix took care of it.

The Petronix seems to be relaible, brothers had one it a Jeep cj for must be 10 years with no problem, I put one in 74 F250 about 5 years ago, no problems. They do recommend that you run their coil with the ignition unit.

I still keep a set of points and condenser on hand as an emergency backup just in case.

The conversions always seem to run 80 to $100, but some points sets are getting expensive, and who knows how long they will be availiable, and it's one less maintaince item to worry about.

Definitely the way to go, in my opinion.

Terry

[jdemaris]

Gotta second Forgefire on this, had the same problem with my 1010, Petronix solved the problem.

You say you had the "same problem", but whatever the actual problem was has not been defined. At least, not as far as I can tell. 1010s are known for being bad starters when the wrong coils and/or incorrect resistor bypass methods are used.

1010s start fine when setup correctly. Are you saying you had a 1010 that was indeed setup correctly and still did not start well? Or are you saying you had a poor starting 1010, gave up on the original system, and did better with the conversion?

I ask because problems between different tractors often appear to be similar but are NOT exactly the same. I have no idea what your original problem was, not do I with the other person.

I've got no argument that the conversions work well. I'm simply stating that the OEM breaker system also works well. And, when it does not, it's because something isn't right.

I prefer the old breaker system simply because I know I can always fix it and won't be stuck for parts. If the electronics in these conversions were more main-stream like with cars and trucks - I'd like the idea better. I can go to any auto parts store and buy replacement electronic igntion parts for any make of car and truck. Thirty years from now it's likely to be the same. But, for esoteric stuff made for tractors by individual companies - it does not work that way. At least, on a historical perspective, never has yet.

I'll add that I'm not a member of the "correct parts" police. I'll use anything if it works better. I'm am claiming that the 1010 does not suffer from poor OEM engineering that makes it an inherent poor starter.

[ritchiegilby]

had the same problem with mine, turned out to be stuck distributor weights throwing the timing off, did you look at these ?

[Tigerhaze]

Another potential issue is "fuel fouling" of the plugs- when an older tractor engine will not start right away the plugs will get "fuel fouled" and a residue from the gasoline is left on them that causes hard starting. This has happened on my 8N gas tractor and has been discussed on the Yesterday's Tractor disucssion groups. You can't see the residue but can usually smell the unburned gasoline. Fuel fouled plugs can be cleaned- I believe they use lacquer thinner but would need to double check that.

Once you change or clean the plugs out it will start fine. It is more of a symptom than a cause, meaning that the issue is the hard starting and the result is fouled plugs.