1010 glow plugs burn out!!!!

Stan Disbrow · Post by **Stan Disbrow** » Wed Nov 17, 2010 5:40 am

Hi,

Yes, that's true. They buried the glow plugs but good when they added the turbo and went to the electronic injection system. The earlier non-turbo 7.3's had the plugs a lot more accessible by comparison, but it was still a pain. Hence the switch!

It probably takes a little longer for the 1010 plugs to get red hot when inside the iron, but still you have a good idea as to just how long to energize them before attempting a start.

Later!

Stan

digitup2 · Post by **digitup2** » Wed Nov 17, 2010 9:42 am

Stan I changed all my 7.3s over to a different glow plug that the neighboring school bus lines recommended.these things are still Bosh and still fit in the stock hole but plug into a different tip these things never give us a problem any more .My other neighbor uses a flasher relay to never over power the glow plugs .My 6s and 6.4s don't like the cold any better .Two new Scorpion's haven't seen cold weather yet but both these are set up for snow plows so they will have 4 AM starlings the true test of a truck diesel . You guys are talking about 12 and 24 volt systems the starter solenoid went on the Bacon lettuce and tomato the other day and rookie operator decided to do the screw driver cross over he came back out of the engine compartment with a stupid look on his face and a handle with a short stub on it .I said not with 24 volt guy you can weld with 24 volt .Cold weather sure shows the battery starter and electrical system quirks .Glow plug systems are over and above that even and series glow plugs need to have every wire in it's place to work at all .Digitup.

robk · Post by **robk** » Fri Feb 25, 2011 11:26 am

After beating everybody up unmercifully on the subject of how I coulda burned up four brand new glow plugs and hearing from our God and moderator Lavoy that they rarely burn out - especially all at once!! I've concluded that I hooked up my two batteries incorrectly at some point and smoked my new plugs with 24 volts. I don't remember doing it but there's no way batteries hooked in parallel could burn up a heater with the increased amperage, I'm told by professors Ken, H-D and Stan. Hooking up that second battery WRONG is the only answer I can come up with. I'm going to hook them up correctly and continue using the new glow plugs but I'm also going to follow the advice of Stan Disbrow who recommended NOT following the dash instructions because it may start after a minute OR LESS of heating rather than frying the plugs super hot for two minutes. .. many, many thanks for all the thinking and experience boys.

Stan Disbrow · Post by **Stan Disbrow** » Sun Mar 06, 2011 10:06 am

Hi,

Ah. Yes. Putting 24v onto 12v glow plugs would, indeed, ensure their very early demise. They would glow a lot, though, for that little while!

I recall being at a rest stop a few years back. There was a semi with a pickup truck nosed into place just aft of the cab. There were several guys clustered around looking grim.

Well, you know the drill. I just had to wander over and see what was up. It seems that the semi had sat running electrics too long and then didn't have the grunt left in the batteries to get going. The guy in the pick-up was trying to jump the big rig.

What they were looking at was why the pickup erupted in smoke when they tried it. It appears that some modern-day truck drivers are not schooled in truck mechanics. As in no one knew that the batteries in the tractor were wired 24v.

While the 12v batteries wired in series on the tractor didn't have enough of 24v left to crank the starter, the 20 or so volts that were left were more than a match for the 14v maximum of the pick-up truck. Oops.

The brunt of the error was borne by the now-fried jumper cables. However, since the pick-up was running at the time, it's alternator also packed it in. It was still running, and nothing else seemed gone, at least my meter showed that the alternator was the only part bad at that point.

So, we moved his pick up out and put mine in. I was smart enough to jump only one of the tractor's batteries at a time (my 12v to each of his for a few minutes at a time to charge off my alternator). We got him started and then he would charge himself. I then followed the first pick-up into the next town so he could get a new alternator.

Anyway, yes, mixing up 12v and 24v will always lead to letting the smoke out. You know that electrical stuff is black magic, and it's all done with somke and mirrors, right? Well if you let the smoke out, it all turns black and the magic goes away!

Later!

Stan

robk · Post by **robk** » Sun Mar 06, 2011 11:11 am

I love ya Stan... and the rest of you who are smarter than me. I'll be back with the the NEXT problem I have as a result of the LAST problem I was trying to solve. See next posting about aligning front idlers.

robk · Post by **robk** » Mon Jun 20, 2011 5:02 pm

I can NEVER remember how to wire in parallel versus series. I'm now convinced that ignorance cost me my new glow plugs. This was a great message from Lavoy on the subject of 12V parallel batteries:
"Okay, look at it this way. If you hook both negative posts and both positive posts together, the wires will be running "parallel". In this configuration, you get 12 volts, but double the amps.
For series, you hook the positive post of one battery to the negative post of the other battery, then run your ground and starter cables from the negative on one battery, and the positive on the other battery. This will yield double the voltage, but not double the amperage.
The 24 volt start setup had a way to connect the batteries in series to start, then revert to parallel for running. Keep in mind that in 1960, a 1000CCA battery would have been two feet long and a foot wide. Nowadays, it is easy to find a 1000CCA or more battery that will fit under the seat."

Tigerhaze · Post by **Tigerhaze** » Mon Jun 20, 2011 5:15 pm

robk wrote:I can NEVER remember how to wire in parallel versus series.

I found this document to be an easy reference on hooking up and charging batteries both in parallel and series.

http://www.nyc-arecs.org/Connecting_Bat ... rallel.pdf

afi · Post by **afi** » Thu Apr 10, 2014 4:42 pm

seems like a problem that I have and still have, i posted last year and have not been able to find a solution. My 4th set of glow plugs came in today. I only have one battery in my machine my glow plugs worked fine for a number of years, I put a new harness on the glow plugs and they burn out after one use, I built a test plate so I can see wats going on with the glow plugs and when I power them they get very red in 15 seconds. I am afraid to go the whole 30-60 seconds for fear of burning our another set. none of the wiring diagrams show any resister and I threw away the old harness. Let me know if you ever solved the problem and if anyone could post a picture of there glow plug harness maybe i'm missing something. I have talked to john deere, wellman, electricians mechanics no one seems to have any ideas

robk · Post by **robk** » Thu Apr 10, 2014 6:50 pm

First I'd advise you to read all three preceding pages of this discussion. It is exhaustive and informative. Where did you get the plugs? If they're Chinese, you may have lousy products. All that is addressed here. All the hotlinks in all the posts are still good EXCEPT for Tigerhaze's post right above here. One of those posts is the factory wiring diagram for a 1010 posted by me in 2010 (the year, not the tractor). I can't imagine how a single 12V battery could burn out 4 sets of glow plugs.

afi · Post by **afi** » Fri Apr 11, 2014 3:55 am

thanks for your reply, it must be the way i wired the glow plug harness. its all i did to start the problem. the wiring diagram just shows a single wire to feed all 4 plugs. i'm at a loss and just plan on heating the plugs for maybe 10-15 seconds and hoping for the best

afi · Post by **afi** » Fri May 02, 2014 4:21 pm

well I'm giving up on this, I'm gonna just try with 5 seconds on the plugs before I start. had the plugs out and hooked them up so I could watch and they get red at 5 seconds and very red at 10 seconds. I think there should be less than 12 volts going to them but cannot figure out what in the old harness woiuld have reduced the voltage. very frustrating Have you had any more problems and how long do you heat the plugs?

robk · Post by **robk** » Fri May 02, 2014 8:29 pm

This has been a marvelous bunch of experts for me… but once in a while, you run into a difficult problem that can't be analyzed any more. Short heat times was also suggested to me after I burned out my new set of plugs. I'm convinced I wired my second battery wrong to produce 24V. The plugs only last for a couple of starts but, WOW, does it sound great. Zoom. It's running. I was told good glow plugs in a good motor should start in any weather. I didn't find that to be true for me here in Connecticut in 10 degree cold. I didn't have enough in two new batteries to glow AND start mine. I had to recharge the batteries and give it a VERY short sniff of ether to get it to pop off. Now in warmer weather, it starts with a minute or so of "glowing". Don't be afraid to offer more thoughts here. There's an answer for everything.

Post by **Lavoy** » Sat May 03, 2014 11:00 am

I guess I don't have an answer other than to say the system was designed to work, and if it doesn't there is something wrong.
As far as the plugs glowing, I would have to believe they are going to, only way to get any BTU's out of something that small I would think. Heating elements glow, and all a glow plug is is a small heating element.
As far as time, 5-10 seconds is pointless, you need to heat long enough to warm up the air enough to put some residual heat into the pre-combustion chamber.
Our 1010 diesel will pre-heat for at least a minute minimum and still turn the engine over fine in the teens at least with a single 800CCA battery.
Lavoy

Stan Disbrow · Post by **Stan Disbrow** » Sat May 03, 2014 12:18 pm

Hi,

Some of the glow plugs are meant to catch the very edge of the injector spray. That heats the fuel enough to start combustion, then the fuel removes enough heat to keep the plug from burning out. This is seen on newer systems, and they have a 'wait to start light', which is usually a 15 or so second wait. Once the light goes out, crank. If it does not catch, power off, then back on, and run the cycle again.

Now, what I do not know is if the 1010 is such that the injector spray is supposed to hit the end of the glow plug or not. But, the plugs meant to be cooled by some of the fuel spray will burn out quickly if they do not get sprayed.....

I had that issue with a 93 International. The replacement plugs were a little on the short side (length, not ohms) and missed their spray. That meant running more cold start cycles, then also short life span of the plugs. I went through a dozen of those on three cylinders before I figured out why the new ones liked to burn out all the time, yet the other five original plugs kept in working. Maddening, to say the least!

Stan

Post by **Lavoy** » Sat May 03, 2014 3:40 pm

I doubt it is supposed to hit the spray, otherwise they wouldn't recommend up to a two minute heat time.
Lavoy

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1010 glow plugs burn out!!!!

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