Governor lever stuck on 440IC
Governor lever stuck on 440IC
I'd really like to get behind the dash, in order to do some re-wiring and install new tubing to the oil pressure gage. However, the governor lever (also known as "Lever, speed control" Key #2, p/n T 11010T, p.21 of the parts list) is rusted solid to the shaft that goes thru the dash to the U-joint. In addition, the U-joint itself is real sloppy and another reason to get the lever off is to replace the U-joint too.
I am currently dosing it with various penetrating oils, a bit of heat, and patience, but not getting anywhere. Previous owner, a close friend, recalls that this was always a problem for him too. Possibly stuck there since he got the machine in 1977. Before the cutoff wheel goes on the angle grinder (sacrificing the shaft, not the lever, of course) I wondered if anyone might have been through this and have a few tricks to share.
I am currently dosing it with various penetrating oils, a bit of heat, and patience, but not getting anywhere. Previous owner, a close friend, recalls that this was always a problem for him too. Possibly stuck there since he got the machine in 1977. Before the cutoff wheel goes on the angle grinder (sacrificing the shaft, not the lever, of course) I wondered if anyone might have been through this and have a few tricks to share.
Best regards,
Steve O.
1958 440IC w/ blade (602?)
Steve O.
1958 440IC w/ blade (602?)
- DukeofDeere
- 1010 crawler
- Posts: 443
- Joined: Wed Oct 26, 2011 7:12 am
- Location: Hudsonville Michigan
Lots of heat.
Lavoy
Lavoy
Parts and restoration for antique and late model John Deere crawlers.
Owner and moderator www.jdcrawlers.com
Owner and moderator www.jdcrawlers.com
Thanks Duke and Lavoy. The problem with applying heat is that the lever is really close to the dash and there are gages immediately next to it. Putting enough heat on it to make a difference is going to cook those gages for sure.
Upon further consideration, I realized I can't cut off the shaft as I mentioned earlier, because I can't see it. The boss on the governor lever extends down below the dash.
I might have hit upon a brainstorm, though. I am thinking about drilling and tapping straight down into the lever, then by threading in a bolt, it will tend to pull the lever off the shaft. There are some details to this idea that I'll have to make sure I get right. Must not drill and tap too deep. The idea fails if I make threads in the shaft too. Must get enough threads so they don't just strip out. Must use a bottoming tap.
It might just work.
Upon further consideration, I realized I can't cut off the shaft as I mentioned earlier, because I can't see it. The boss on the governor lever extends down below the dash.
I might have hit upon a brainstorm, though. I am thinking about drilling and tapping straight down into the lever, then by threading in a bolt, it will tend to pull the lever off the shaft. There are some details to this idea that I'll have to make sure I get right. Must not drill and tap too deep. The idea fails if I make threads in the shaft too. Must get enough threads so they don't just strip out. Must use a bottoming tap.
It might just work.
Best regards,
Steve O.
1958 440IC w/ blade (602?)
Steve O.
1958 440IC w/ blade (602?)
- DukeofDeere
- 1010 crawler
- Posts: 443
- Joined: Wed Oct 26, 2011 7:12 am
- Location: Hudsonville Michigan
Hi Duke:
There is no bolt on the top side center of the lever. There is a setscrew that comes in from the side. There are three different levers for the 440, shown across pg 20-22 (actual page number, not the PDF page number) at this link:
http://jdpc.deere.com/jdpc/pdfs/PC0573.pdf
Pg 20 shows two of the levers. Mine is #2; sounds like Duke is talking about #42 which does show a bolt in the center. (A third style of lever, which moves linearly back and forth rather than rotating, is shown on page 22)
My idea is to drill out my lever so it more or less ends up looking like #42, then, tapping the hole with a bottoming tap. Then I can install a bolt (as well as liberal amounts of penetrating oil; I like Kroil too) and it should act as a puller. Plenty of heat, too. And, if it ends up that the wall is too thin and my threads strip out, the next action will be to weld a nut on.
There is no bolt on the top side center of the lever. There is a setscrew that comes in from the side. There are three different levers for the 440, shown across pg 20-22 (actual page number, not the PDF page number) at this link:
http://jdpc.deere.com/jdpc/pdfs/PC0573.pdf
Pg 20 shows two of the levers. Mine is #2; sounds like Duke is talking about #42 which does show a bolt in the center. (A third style of lever, which moves linearly back and forth rather than rotating, is shown on page 22)
My idea is to drill out my lever so it more or less ends up looking like #42, then, tapping the hole with a bottoming tap. Then I can install a bolt (as well as liberal amounts of penetrating oil; I like Kroil too) and it should act as a puller. Plenty of heat, too. And, if it ends up that the wall is too thin and my threads strip out, the next action will be to weld a nut on.
Best regards,
Steve O.
1958 440IC w/ blade (602?)
Steve O.
1958 440IC w/ blade (602?)
- DukeofDeere
- 1010 crawler
- Posts: 443
- Joined: Wed Oct 26, 2011 7:12 am
- Location: Hudsonville Michigan
I do recall the different levers.
I'm sitting in the sun down in southern Florida
Found a week to relax.
Attach a slide hammer to the bottom side and gently tap her free.
I had one stuck up front over the engine as well as the dash.
I'm trying to remember the acronym....
Penetrating oil
Pressure
Pounding
Patients??
Duke
I'm sitting in the sun down in southern Florida
Found a week to relax.
Attach a slide hammer to the bottom side and gently tap her free.
I had one stuck up front over the engine as well as the dash.
I'm trying to remember the acronym....
Penetrating oil
Pressure
Pounding
Patients??
Duke
Hey Duke:
Florida, huh? I'm in New England and it's been 33F and pouring rain for the last two days. I'd rather have sunny and dry and 10F, personally. Or, 70F would be great too!
Problem with slide hammer is that the lever extends down below the sheetmetal dash. No way to get the arms of the puller onto it unless I do some damage to the dash. Not quite ready to go there, since I *think* my drill & tap idea has a good shot and will be pretty nondestructive overall. The other worry about the slide hammer is where the forces are going... as you beat on the lever, you are also beating against a boss which is cast into the dash support structure. I am concerned about busting off that boss.
Florida, huh? I'm in New England and it's been 33F and pouring rain for the last two days. I'd rather have sunny and dry and 10F, personally. Or, 70F would be great too!
Problem with slide hammer is that the lever extends down below the sheetmetal dash. No way to get the arms of the puller onto it unless I do some damage to the dash. Not quite ready to go there, since I *think* my drill & tap idea has a good shot and will be pretty nondestructive overall. The other worry about the slide hammer is where the forces are going... as you beat on the lever, you are also beating against a boss which is cast into the dash support structure. I am concerned about busting off that boss.
Best regards,
Steve O.
1958 440IC w/ blade (602?)
Steve O.
1958 440IC w/ blade (602?)
- DukeofDeere
- 1010 crawler
- Posts: 443
- Joined: Wed Oct 26, 2011 7:12 am
- Location: Hudsonville Michigan
Duke: lever is forged steel, I believe. Definitely not aluminum. It is rusted! I have removed the setscrew (#3 on the diagram) that holds the lever, which was also rusted, but I managed. With the setscrew out, it gives you a look "inside" so to speak. Rusty. I am applying Kroil into that hole, tapping it with a hammer, and applying heat and patience. Not getting anywhere yet.
jtrichard: that would be a great idea, if it was possible to access that pin. However it's way up underneath the big casting that supports the dash, the hood, the rear of the tank, etc. No way I can see to get a hammer and punch onto the pin. Just no clear shot at it.
jtrichard: that would be a great idea, if it was possible to access that pin. However it's way up underneath the big casting that supports the dash, the hood, the rear of the tank, etc. No way I can see to get a hammer and punch onto the pin. Just no clear shot at it.
Best regards,
Steve O.
1958 440IC w/ blade (602?)
Steve O.
1958 440IC w/ blade (602?)
i did not know how much room or lack of there was .... just a thought... i was looking at parts break down.... can you get a hold of any of the old asbestos siding to use to protect the dash and heat the crap out of it as fast as possible while trying to twist it
2010 with 622 dozer with mod. 35 ripper and a 2010 with 622 dozer bought in 1969 and a 2010 loader with drott and mod. 36 ripper
jtrichard: Thanks! I appreciate your comments. While I don't have a line on some old asbestos, I have done very similar things with a plain piece of sheetmetal. As long as there's an air gap under it, sheetmetal makes an excellent heat shield. This is a very good thought.
I have more than my fair share of experience wrenching rusty old stuff and I have all the basics covered... heat, penetrating oil, patience. I suppose, my reason for posting here was to see if anyone had been-there-done-that and knew of either some non-obvious trick, or maybe a non-obvious technical detail getting in the way.
I appreciate ALL the comments! It's like brainstorming; even if the ideas being tossed around don't work, the beauty is that one or more of these ideas might be the trigger that sparks the idea that DOES finally work.
I have more than my fair share of experience wrenching rusty old stuff and I have all the basics covered... heat, penetrating oil, patience. I suppose, my reason for posting here was to see if anyone had been-there-done-that and knew of either some non-obvious trick, or maybe a non-obvious technical detail getting in the way.
I appreciate ALL the comments! It's like brainstorming; even if the ideas being tossed around don't work, the beauty is that one or more of these ideas might be the trigger that sparks the idea that DOES finally work.
Best regards,
Steve O.
1958 440IC w/ blade (602?)
Steve O.
1958 440IC w/ blade (602?)
- DukeofDeere
- 1010 crawler
- Posts: 443
- Joined: Wed Oct 26, 2011 7:12 am
- Location: Hudsonville Michigan
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