440 IC won't start

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jbh
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440 IC won't start

Post by jbh » Sun Oct 27, 2013 4:54 pm

Hi all, I'm new to forum, but have been reading great posts for a while. I just bought a 440 IC, and it was running, although poorly. I took the carb apart and cleaned, looked OK, put back on and now won't fire. Gas runs out the intake, but no fuel going to cylinders. Float appears to be OK. I'm stumped, and hope someone might have some advice. Plugs are firing, timing is set (at least as well as I can without the engine running) and it wants to fire if I put gas in the spark plug holes. Any ideas? The service manual I have doesn't have any info about the carb - says to refer to another carb manual which John Deere website doesn't seem to have.

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Lavoy
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Post by Lavoy » Sun Oct 27, 2013 6:22 pm

Maybe I misunderstood, but if you have gas at the manifold, ( I assume you mean at the carb) there has to be gas getting to the cylinders. If you have raw gas running out the carb, you are way too rich, and it is flooded.
What did you do when you cleaned the carb? Complete disassembly including jets, and a thorough soak in carb solvent?
If it is a fuel issue, it will run on carb cleaner sprayed into the carb when cranking. If not, not a fuel issue, has to be something else.
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DukeofDeere
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Post by DukeofDeere » Sun Oct 27, 2013 10:14 pm

With the hose off the carb look to see does the choke close completely?
Is the relief missing or broke on the choke disk?
Obviously you are not be getting enough fuel to the cylinders.
If choke is working properly I am guessing the plug wires are switched.

Duke

jbh
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440 IC won't start

Post by jbh » Mon Oct 28, 2013 9:41 am

Thanks for your replies. Lavoy, yes, there is gas at the carb intake (as in, it runs out when cranking) and when I cleaned the carb, I did dis-assemble, including jets, and blew out the passages. Did not soak in carb cleaner, so maybe that's my next step. Passages all seemed to be clear, but not sure. Can't see how fuel would not be drawn into cylinders when so much is present at carb intake, but that seems to be the case.

Duke, I wondered about the plug wires, but have tried changing and no difference. When I took them off, I seemed to remember they were different than the pic in service manual, but not sure. Do you know what position the wires are supposed to be? The choke is closing, and the relief is present.

Thanks for any thoughts/help. Its starting to get cold here, and I need to get this machine working!

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Post by Lavoy » Mon Oct 28, 2013 3:05 pm

My guess is bad float, or stuck, still think you are flooded or too rich. When you turn the fuel on at the tank, only crack the shutoff slightly, not open it wide open. Then try and start, that might identify a problem.
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Gil
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Post by Gil » Mon Oct 28, 2013 5:54 pm

These carburetors will pour gas out the intake if the engine does not start and you keep cranking it. So your problem may not be the carburetor. Did you do anything to the distributor, points, coil wires, plugs, etc. when you were working on the carburetor? When you say there is no fuel going to the cylinders, how do you know? One sign would be that the plugs are completely dry. If they are wet you are getting gas and something else is preventing ignition.

If it is the carburetor, make sure you are not setting the throttle lever too high. The carburetor linkage could also have been moved to be too rich. You need a strong battery to make the engine turn rapidly. You should only need a couple of revolutions before it fires. Don’t keep cranking it. If it does flood, remove the air intake rubber coupling, open the choke plate, and air it out for a few minutes. Remove the spark plugs and let the cylinders dry out at the same time. Gil
JD440-ICD loader; JD440-IC bulldozer; JD440-ICD backhoe; JD440-I backhoe; JD440-I tractor; + five recumbent JD440-ICs

jbh
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440 IC won't start

Post by jbh » Mon Oct 28, 2013 11:04 pm

Finally got it going. Since there was so much gas coming out of the carb inlet, I thought the mixture was too rich so turned load needle too far in. That seemed to cut off fuel, and yes, plugs were dry. Opened load adjuster up a bit and it fired up. Now it runs, but surges with the governor, so I'm thinking the timing advancer may be seized. That's my next step to check. Thanks for your ideas and help. Now I just have to find out why the starter is not engaging! Guess I ran it too much.

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Post by Lavoy » Tue Oct 29, 2013 9:03 am

Advance will not cause surging, 99% of the time it is the carb.
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jtrichard
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Post by jtrichard » Tue Oct 29, 2013 12:09 pm

turn the main jet screw out 1/2 to 3/4 turn and it should help
2010 with 622 dozer with mod. 35 ripper and a 2010 with 622 dozer bought in 1969 and a 2010 loader with drott and mod. 36 ripper

jbh
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440 IC won't start

Post by jbh » Thu Oct 31, 2013 7:29 pm

Thanks for all the advice! Now I just have to find a spring for the drive on the starter. Anybody have any ideas where one could be found?
John

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Lavoy
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Post by Lavoy » Thu Oct 31, 2013 8:34 pm

I have new complete drives available, not sure the spring is available separately.
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