What set if tracks to put back on my 440?

wizner85 · Post by **wizner85** » Sun Jun 29, 2014 1:39 pm

Putting my 440 back together and I have a dilemma.
I have three sets of tracks at the house from other dozers.
The original set on this 440 was too far gone to salvage at all.
First set is a 1010 4 bolts to hold te pad 36 links and pins and bushings worn almost enough that they need replaced. Problem with this set is, one side has really nice pads the other side does not. So I would most likely cut the pads off and use a set of 350 pads off a Dozer I have laying around ( if they fit?)

Second set is off a 420 35 links 2 bolts to hold the pads. These pins and bushings are in better shape than the 1010.( I am leaning in this direction). But to fit them properly on a 440 I need to add a link somehow. Or could I swap out the 440 front idler for a 420 since I believe that is the only difference? One last thought would be to just use te 35 links as in and squeeze back in the hydraulic adjuster. Is there enough room to do this? There was 2.5 inches of adjustment left to the end of the track adjuster rail in them.

Third set is on a loader 440 that I might part out. Decent tracks and pins, but tey have loader pads. I'd have to cut them off and put different pads on. Not sure I want to part out this loader since it has potential, but I want this Dozer to be nice as well. This set if tracks is in the same condition as the 420.

Or possibly a forth option. There is a guy 8 hours away that says he has a decent set if tracks off a 1010 for 500 bucks. But we know how good that can be....

Thoughts in this would be great since I'm stuck on my dilemma for a week now on which direction to take.

DukeofDeere · Post by **DukeofDeere** » Sun Jun 29, 2014 3:32 pm

I would use the 420 tracks and add a rail section to it to get the added link you need.
If the pins and bushings are good I don't think you can short track it.

IMHO
Duke

JimAnderson · Post by **JimAnderson** » Sun Jun 29, 2014 7:21 pm

The front idler on the 440 and 420/430 five roller are the same diameter.The track frame of the 440 is longer overall than the 420/430.
You need 36 links for the 440 so adding a link to a 420 track is the
best option.If it were mine I'd go with the best rails as pins and bushings
can be replaced but rails unless 350's are hard to find in useable shape.
Luck,JimAnderson

wizner85 · Post by **wizner85** » Mon Jun 30, 2014 10:40 am

Could have sworn a 420 front idler was smaller diameter than a 440 front idler. I have a set of 420 front idlers.

I like adding the extra rail link idea. How do I press out 1 link from an existing chain without a track press to do this? I figure all I need is a good bushing, and I can use a master pin to put it back together.

Any problems with two master pins?

DukeofDeere · Post by **DukeofDeere** » Mon Jun 30, 2014 2:18 pm

Track press would be best...
2 masters won't hurt a thing.

Duke

JimAnderson · Post by **JimAnderson** » Mon Jun 30, 2014 2:23 pm

Both 440 and 420/430 front idlers are roughly 19" in diameter at the
area in rolling contact with the rail.Master pins have a head that has
flats to keep the pin from rotating.This means that the rail must be
notched to accomodate pin head.Also the opposite side must be ground
down to make room for the retaining snap ring.This would only matter
if you use a standard rail section.If you used the masterpin rail link
to make up the 36th link then you could end up just replacing its
bushing.With out a track press it can be tough to remove a link
without cutoff wheels or smoke wrench.Please be careful if you
try to cobble up your own press.Failures can be fatal.
Luck JimAnderson

wizner85 · Post by **wizner85** » Mon Jun 30, 2014 6:45 pm

So I went out to pull dimensions, because I could have sworn a 420 idler is about an inch or so less in diameter.
My 420 front idler is about 4'8" in circumference.
The 440 is 5 ' circumference roughly. I measured area in contact with the rail.
So if the link is about 5 inches long, and I have 35 links, then the difference between the 440 and 420 front idler should allow the 35 links to work.
It am I not thinking straight on this? I was using Pi there for a while and got hungry. Didn't have any Pi so I grabbed a beer

Sprockets and bushings have a little wear in my favor as well, not brand new but not beat to heck either.

I'm thinking if the 420 front idler fits in the 440 idler brackets why wouldn't I be able to use this arrangement?

Thanks for all your help. I have the hot wrench on standby if this proves not to be feasible by the experts.. I wouldn't use a press just heat and 20 lbs sledge and more heat and sledge and heat and sledge. Might be a curse word or two in the mix.
Fyi tried to post several times. iPhone is giving me headaches. Sorry if posted multiple times...

JimAnderson · Post by **JimAnderson** » Mon Jun 30, 2014 7:36 pm

The measurements I posted were taken from idlers that are not mounted.
When I made them the parts allowed direct diameter verification.The 440
idlers are NOS and the 420 ones are used.You may be able with used
parts run 35 link tracks on a 440.Its up to you to give it a try.I would
like to know if it works.Luck,JimAnderson

Post by **Lavoy** » Mon Jun 30, 2014 11:18 pm

420 idler will absolutely not fit in 440 brackets, completely different axle and brackets. With any accumulated wear, usually 35 link tracks will fit on a 440, might have no adjustment left to go shorter, but usually you can shoehorn them on.
Lavoy

wizner85 · Post by **wizner85** » Tue Jul 01, 2014 6:35 am

Well so much for the 420 idler on the 440 bracket idea....

Hot wrench is probably next step.

Thanks for the input. I'll post a couple of pics when I get it all back together.

Paul Buhler · Post by **Paul Buhler** » Tue Jul 01, 2014 8:55 am

I'd try the 35 link set. If each link has only 1/16" wear, that's 35/16 accumulated wear; over 2" of stretch, or about half a link. If you raise a track off the ground so that you can slide the old out from under sideways, the "new" set will go under reasonably easy and then when you reinstall and pull them together to put in the master, the whole setup can realign and adjust so that they may fit.
For what it's worth, the last time I put my tracks on, I positioned the master mid-way on the front idler so I could come-along, align with a drift and hammer the master pin in place. I "drove" the tracks over the upper idler and forward using the spinning sprocket to do the heavy work. I use a 6' 2x8 placed over the front and upper idlers to carry the tracks forward until almost in position. This saved a lot of heavy lifting. My tracks had the pin heads on the outside, so reassembly was easier. Two people make this job a lot easier, but I did mine alone.
The nice thing about these machines is that the tracks are relatively lighter and can be manhandled easier than on bigger machines - I used some liquid refreshment periodically to keep things in perspective. Good luck. Paul

wizner85 · Post by **wizner85** » Tue Jul 01, 2014 10:16 am

Thanks Paul,

I think I will try and fit the 35 links on there, and if it don't work, then time to put in the 36th link.

Tractor was in pieces and is mostly back together. Need to paint the sping, and track adjuster, and 440 front idler then I can try the sprockets. Motor is in, and I am buttoning up the head, and all that next.

Might have to wait until the weekend to do all this. It is way too hot for all this manual labor...... and 2 road sodas in, I feel like parking my rear under a tree, and throwing the tennis ball with the pups.

Of course I can't see much around the property at this point since I am completely surrounded by the corn crop already. It's already at 4 foot tall and growing close to a 1/2 foot or more a week.

Gil · Post by **Gil** » Wed Jul 02, 2014 7:34 pm

Like PaPa always said about corn...
"Knee high by the fourth of July."

I have a similar problem trying to pick the best tracks from a pile of not so perfect options. In my case I need 12 inch pads to use with an inside mount dozer blade. All my dozer pads are 14 inch, so I am considering using a good chain with flat pads off of a loader crawler. Not optimal, but the loader crawlers push pretty well without slipping when digging. The loader crawler weighs a little more, so that might be an issue, but I don't do that much serious bulldozing either. Since I already have the track, my only investment will be the time it takes to run them on. Gil

Stan Disbrow · Post by **Stan Disbrow** » Wed Jul 02, 2014 7:41 pm

Hi,

Loaders put their digging weight onto the front. Dozers onto the rear. Then, the loaders have counterweights to keep the rear down.

The light front lifts up with a dozer digging. When I get into it, the front half of my tracks are not pulling against the ground, only the back half. This is why dozers have grousers and loaders don't. The grousers are rougher on the rollers, but you really need them.

I only have half of mine left on 10 in snow pads, and she can no longer dig as hard as she used to as the tracks slip. I think you will miss grousers pretty quickly with a dozer.

Stan

wizner85 · Post by **wizner85** » Wed Jul 02, 2014 8:53 pm

Is a 1010 track adjuster spring the same as a 440? I have a really nice set of 1010 front idlers , adjusters, tubes, and springs I'd rather use on the 440, then the half crappy 440 set that was on it.

Just trying to make the best dozer out of all these parts I accumulated.

I'm also thinking of putting the 1010 dual spool control valve on it for the 63 blade. I like the control valve on the fender more than reaching forward, and hitting my knee on the dash ( stock gas 440).

It's about 50 percent together at the moment, and if I get the under carriage back together at least I can move the boat anchor around if I need too.

Thanks for the help.

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What set if tracks to put back on my 440?

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